I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).
I also suggest to move PHP 4 downloads to the museum. I suggest though
to make a clear visible link from php.net/downloads.php to the museum
and make a clear statement that PHP 4 has moved (I am sure there are
still many who look for it for application compatibiity reasons).
A year may seem a long time but it isn't when a company has to port a
big application over. Also don't forget that one of the reasons so many
people dislike Microsoft is because they constantly screw customers with
support for older versions. There's nothing wrong with us being better
on this front even if it comes at the expense of adoption of newer
versions. Also I think just making the above mentioned statements and
moving the downloads will have an immediate impact and won't linger
things for another year.
Andi
-----Original Message-----
From: Rasmus Lerdorf [mailto:rasmus@lerdorf.com]
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 8:59 AM
To: Antony Dovgal
Cc: Derick Rethans; PHP Developers Mailing List
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Antony Dovgal wrote:
I'm breaking your vote only rule. I don't really understand what
dropping support means if we will still release security fixes.
That's the mode we have been in for at least a year, so what would
change at the end of the year?Dropping support to me means PHP 4 becomes like PHP 3. No new
releases for any reason, and I don't think we can
realistically do that yet.
Saying we are dropping support and then continuing on with
the status
quo seems odd to me.To me it means in the first place that we can add a canned
answer to
the bugtracker which would say "PHP4 is not supported
anymore, install PHP5"
and close all PHP4 only reports.So no bug-fixes, no releases except for ones fixing
critical security
problems.
And even that should be ceased either in say.. 1 or 2 years.When was the last time we did a PHP4-only bug fix?
My fear is that the impact of the no-more-support statement is hurt
when we qualify it with the fact that nothing is really changing.I'd be more in favour of a statement that put a final death date on it
which means no new releases of any sort. We could still say
security-fixes only by the end of the year and then death by 08/08/08
or something like that.-Rasmus
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Andi Gutmans wrote:
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).
The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because the word
for 8 sounds like 发 which means prosper or wealth.
-Rasmus
Cool :)
-----Original Message-----
From: Rasmus Lerdorf [mailto:rasmus@lerdorf.com]
Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 10:26 PM
To: Andi Gutmans
Cc: PHP Developers Mailing List
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Andi Gutmans wrote:
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of
the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds
good and gives people about a year).The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture.
For example the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at
8:08:08 pm because the word for 8 sounds like 发 which means
prosper or wealth.-Rasmus
The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because the word
for 8 sounds like 发 which means prosper or wealth.
Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4
end-of-life to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a
suitable timezone :)
Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect
stas@zend.com http://www.zend.com/
(408)253-8829 MSN: stas@zend.com
The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because the word
for 8 sounds like 发 which means prosper or wealth.Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4 end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable timezone :)
GMT+8 of course...
Derick
The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because the word
for 8 sounds like 发 which means prosper or wealth.Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4 end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable timezone :)GMT+8 of course...
Which, appropriately enough, includes China.
So: support for PHP4 ends when the Olympics start.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/3d/Timezones_optimized.png
--
Alain Williams
Linux Consultant - Mail systems, Web sites, Networking, Programmer, IT Lecturer.
+44 (0) 787 668 0256 http://www.phcomp.co.uk/
Parliament Hill Computers Ltd. Registration Information: http://www.phcomp.co.uk/contact.php
#include <std_disclaimer.h
The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For
example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because
the word
for 8 sounds like 发 which means prosper or wealth.Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP
4 end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable
timezone :)GMT+8 of course...
Which, appropriately enough, includes China.
So: support for PHP4 ends when the Olympics start.
one day porting to the next major version of PHP will be olympic ;)
regards,
Lukas
Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4 end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable timezone :)
Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante meridiem) as
it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak and write about this event.
Lars Gunther
Keryx Web wrote:
Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4
end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable
timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante meridiem) as
it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak and write about this event.
Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
-R
Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4
end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable
timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante meridiem) as
it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak and write about this event.Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or Israel. :)
--
Tomas
Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare official PHP 4
end-of-life
to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to choose a suitable
timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante meridiem) as
it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak and write about this event.Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or Israel. :)
What about 8/8/8 8pm in china and 01/01/08 Canada, UK, USA.. that way
we can get rid of it quickly and if it's meaningful for chinese people
to use the number 8, we can do it on 8/8/8 for them (irony/joke) ?
Seriously.. I don't really see the point in keeping it for another
year.. imho end of the year is great and more than enough time to
upgrade, we've got to cut the cord sometimes.. why not keep it until
9/9/9 since it's 6/6/6 upside down and means the devil.. the end of
things.. could also be the end of php4
--
Tomas--
D
Because some of us don't believe 6 months is enough time for the broad
market to make the move.
One year is more suitable.
As we already stated the message would already be strong today and
people wouldn't wait until the year ends with an end-of-life coming up.
Andi
-----Original Message-----
From: david.coallier@gmail.com
[mailto:david.coallier@gmail.com] On Behalf Of David Coallier
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 2:21 PM
To: Tomas Kuliavas
Cc: internals@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare
official PHP
4 end-of-life to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to
choose a suitable timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante
meridiem) as it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak
and write about this event.Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or
Israel. :)What about 8/8/8 8pm in china and 01/01/08 Canada, UK, USA..
that way we can get rid of it quickly and if it's meaningful
for chinese people to use the number 8, we can do it on 8/8/8
for them (irony/joke) ?
Seriously.. I don't really see the point in keeping it for
another year.. imho end of the year is great and more than
enough time to upgrade, we've got to cut the cord sometimes..
why not keep it until
9/9/9 since it's 6/6/6 upside down and means the devil.. the
end of things.. could also be the end of php4--
Tomas--
To
unsubscribe,
visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.phpD
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Because some of us don't believe 6 months is enough time for the broad
market to make the move.
One year is more suitable.
As we already stated the message would already be strong today and
people wouldn't wait until the year ends with an end-of-life coming up.
Andi
But after PHP4 is dropped, people can still use it, so if people
really need to use it longer then they can just continue using it,
once they are done they can still move on.
Tijnema
-----Original Message-----
From: david.coallier@gmail.com
[mailto:david.coallier@gmail.com] On Behalf Of David Coallier
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 2:21 PM
To: Tomas Kuliavas
Cc: internals@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare
official PHP
4 end-of-life to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to
choose a suitable timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante
meridiem) as it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak
and write about this event.Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or
Israel. :)What about 8/8/8 8pm in china and 01/01/08 Canada, UK, USA..
that way we can get rid of it quickly and if it's meaningful
for chinese people to use the number 8, we can do it on 8/8/8
for them (irony/joke) ?
Seriously.. I don't really see the point in keeping it for
another year.. imho end of the year is great and more than
enough time to upgrade, we've got to cut the cord sometimes..
why not keep it until
9/9/9 since it's 6/6/6 upside down and means the devil.. the
end of things.. could also be the end of php4--
Tomas--
To
unsubscribe,
visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.phpD
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Vote for PHP Color Coding in Gmail! -> http://gpcc.tijnema.info
No. If they don't get security updates then they can't really use it
anymore...
-----Original Message-----
From: Tijnema [mailto:tijnema@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 4:29 PM
To: Andi Gutmans
Cc: David Coallier; Tomas Kuliavas; internals@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Because some of us don't believe 6 months is enough time
for the broad
market to make the move.
One year is more suitable.
As we already stated the message would already be strong today and
people wouldn't wait until the year ends with an
end-of-life coming up.
AndiBut after PHP4 is dropped, people can still use it, so if
people really need to use it longer then they can just
continue using it, once they are done they can still move on.Tijnema
-----Original Message-----
From: david.coallier@gmail.com
[mailto:david.coallier@gmail.com] On Behalf Of David Coallier
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 2:21 PM
To: Tomas Kuliavas
Cc: internals@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare
official PHP
4 end-of-life to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we
only need to
choose a suitable timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante
meridiem) as it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speak
and write about this event.Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or
Israel. :)What about 8/8/8 8pm in china and 01/01/08 Canada, UK, USA..
that way we can get rid of it quickly and if it's meaningful for
chinese people to use the number 8, we can do it on 8/8/8
for them
(irony/joke) ?
Seriously.. I don't really see the point in keeping it
for another
year.. imho end of the year is great and more than enough time to
upgrade, we've got to cut the cord sometimes..
why not keep it until
9/9/9 since it's 6/6/6 upside down and means the devil..
the end of
things.. could also be the end of php4--
Tomas--
To
unsubscribe,
visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.phpD
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To
unsubscribe,
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To
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Vote for PHP Color Coding in Gmail! -> http://gpcc.tijnema.info
No. If they don't get security updates then they can't really use it
anymore...
That's the ideal world. They should really not use it anymore but they
can and they will. No matter what we do. I saw many hosts with
outdated versions or using old Debian or BSD setups (have been used a
4.3 or 4.2 in the last months). Some Linux distributors will certainly
take care of php5 for an even longer period.
It is not really important if it is one year or six months (not like
php4 gives us a lot of work :), my preference still goes to the end of
this year. From my point of view, the year is merely a marketing
argument, if it helps us to get a better image, why not...
--Pierre
That's the ideal world.
Unfortunately yes.
They should really not use it anymore but they
can and they will. No matter what we do.
Right.
Some Linux distributors will certainly
take care of php5 for an even longer period.
Yes, about 6 or 7 years more.
It is not really important if it is one year or six months (not like
php4 gives us a lot of work :), my preference still goes to the end of
this year. From my point of view, the year is merely a marketing
argument, if it helps us to get a better image, why not...
IMHO this should be done this way
-
Announce clearly that PHP4 has reached EOL ASAP.
-
Stop any kind of non-security bugfixing inmediately ( well.
that is happening now anyway, :-) ) This include marking as wont fix
all the opened PHP4 bug reports and removing PHP4 from the version
list in the bugtracker as well adding a warning in the bug report form
about this. -
Move PHP4 releases to the Museum ASAP.
-
gave users a reasonable time to discontinue security fixes (no less
that 8 months IMHO) also state clearly that this covers only critical
security bugs. -
Fix the documentation, the migration to PHP5 documents are missing
many backward incompatible changes.
just as an example.
http://php.net/manual/en/migration5.incompatible.php does not list the
fact that you cannot reasign $this and that unset($this) does nothing.
there are many others.
- finally people will attempt to use backward compatibilty hacks like
the horrendous and non-working like zend.ze1_compatibility_mode, it is
very important to either fix it or remove it ( I suggest removing it)
, there are many extensions that dont even work or crash with it
enabled.
my $2 chilean pesos.
With the benefit of a lot of reading in this thread...
And not sure my vote even counts.
+1 PHP4 link to museum
+1 Announce ASAP "security fixes only until 8/8/8"
It is not "abandoning" users, at this point, to do this, imho.
They've had years to switch to PHP 5.
They've got another years' worth of legacy security-only support.
PHP 5 is stable enough and easy enough to switch to, for 99.99% of the
code-base, that only inertia keeps most of these folks on PHP 4.
I don't think it's wise to tie it to PHP 6 release. That sets a bad
precedent. What if PHP 8 takes "forever" to get released, and PHP 6
needs to die?
The only real thing to tie it to is the availability of a stable next
release, and a reasonable "do or die" time-frame to migrate.
--
Some people have a "gift" link here.
Know what I want?
I want you to buy a CD from some indie artist.
http://cdbaby.com/browse/from/lynch
Yeah, I get a buck. So?
Some Linux distributors will certainly
take care of php5 for an even longer period.Yes, about 6 or 7 years more.
I meant PHP4, but I fear that your answer will be the same :)
--Pierre
I have to agree with Andi. The GoPHP5 effort wanted to have a fairly
aggressive timeline because its main target is projects and shared hosts, and
if it was too far in the future no one would notice. The involved projects
also won't actually have their next feature release until later in the year
some time.
The PHP dev team, however, has a different set of targets. It has to include
distros and business servers. A longer warning period is sensible.
Which of course means that the sooner an EOL date is announced, the sooner PHP
4 can be retired. :-) Sometime next summer sounds reasonable, and I've no
problem whatsoever with kitch dates[1].
Because some of us don't believe 6 months is enough time for the broad
market to make the move.
One year is more suitable.
As we already stated the message would already be strong today and
people wouldn't wait until the year ends with an end-of-life coming up.
Andi-----Original Message-----
From: david.coallier@gmail.com
[mailto:david.coallier@gmail.com] On Behalf Of David Coallier
Sent: Sunday, July 08, 2007 2:21 PM
To: Tomas Kuliavas
Cc: internals@lists.php.net
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Well, then I guess we have no choice but to declare
official PHP
4 end-of-life to be on 8:08:08 pm too :) Now we only need to
choose a suitable timezone :)Well, for us using the 24 hr clock I'd say 8:08:08 am (ante
meridiem) as it otherwise will be 20:08:08 when we speakand write about this event.
Except no real geek would schedule anything for 8am.
Easy. Schedule it for 8am in China. Do it in Canada, UK or
Israel. :)
What about 8/8/8 8pm in china and 01/01/08 Canada, UK, USA..
that way we can get rid of it quickly and if it's meaningful
for chinese people to use the number 8, we can do it on 8/8/8
for them (irony/joke) ?
Seriously.. I don't really see the point in keeping it for
another year.. imho end of the year is great and more than
enough time to upgrade, we've got to cut the cord sometimes..
why not keep it until
9/9/9 since it's 6/6/6 upside down and means the devil.. the
end of things.. could also be the end of php4--
Tomas--
Tounsubscribe,
visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
D
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--
Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42
larry@garfieldtech.com ICQ: 6817012
"If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of
exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea,
which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to
himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession
of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it." -- Thomas
Jefferson
On Fri, 06 Jul 2007 22:25:32 -0700, in php.internals
rasmus@lerdorf.com (Rasmus Lerdorf) wrote:
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).The number 8 also has lots of meaning in Chinese culture. For example
the Beijing Olympics will begin on 8/8/8 at 8:08:08 pm because the word
for 8 sounds like ? which means prosper or wealth.
A bit more off-topic: A search for Beijing Olympics at Google gives
Reporters sans frontières (Reporters Without Borders), www.rsf.org ,
as one of the first results. If they don't upgrade their PHP 4
installation it would create a great conspiracy theory :)
(of course, sites won't magically go black at that exact moment)
In general I really think every bit of help and information about the
issue would be paramount. Both information about the motive for
discontinuing support and practical information of how to test
existing scripts with PHP 5.
Usually the PHP development does not bother with specific vendors,
products, hosting companies or recommendations in general and so on.
But if we really are up for it, it might have a pacific effect to put
up some "known-good" lists; stuff like "Yes, phpbb does work with
PHP5. Yes, your ISP does support PHP5. Yes, we can recommend tools to
check for basic PHP5 compatibility. Yes, MySQL does work with PHP5".
The hard part about this is that if the lists are just somewhat
non-exhaustive people could be lead to think that all the stuff not
mentioned is not compatible.
php -l might provide a basic indication of how much havoc an upgrade
will cause. Even though php is downloadable as a shell executable for
Windows as well I think that a bunch of the php developers still using
PHP4 are not into command line administration themselves. Maybe
creating a simple tool (perhaps graphic) to check for the 25 most
common bc breaks as well as lint checks and with detailed information
of what to do.
Basically when we tell users "You can't do that anymore" the obvious
question from the users would be "But what would I have to do
instead?".
I know the development of such a tool might be outside the scope of
usual php development. But if we want to change the behaviour pattern
of the users in the transitional phase it could be necessary.
--
- Peter Brodersen
Usually the PHP development does not bother with specific vendors,
products, hosting companies or recommendations in general and so on.
But if we really are up for it, it might have a pacific effect to put
up some "known-good" lists; stuff like "Yes, phpbb does work with
PHP5. Yes, your ISP does support PHP5. Yes, we can recommend tools to
check for basic PHP5 compatibility. Yes, MySQL does work with PHP5".
The hard part about this is that if the lists are just somewhat
non-exhaustive people could be lead to think that all the stuff not
mentioned is not compatible.
The GoPHP5.org project is part way there, I think. :-) It's not a "works
with" but a "works only with", but still any project listed there is rather
assumed to be PHP 5-friendly.
I hate to volunteer myself for more work, but is there some way that GoPHP5
could help make that transition easier? (We can host upgrade guides written
by others too, I suspect.)
--
Larry Garfield AIM: LOLG42
larry@garfieldtech.com ICQ: 6817012
"If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of
exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea,
which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to
himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession
of every one, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it." -- Thomas
Jefferson
Andi Gutmans wrote:
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).
Gives a year? Nice. Suddenly we've got some kind of time machine here? :D
It's weird that people think of releases like the thing suddenly vanishes from
all servers it's installed on or it stops working altogether when we're just
saying that we drop support for it. I wish that WAS possible...but unfortunately
people still can install it from existing tar balls..and it will work just fine.
I also suggest to move PHP 4 downloads to the museum. I suggest though
to make a clear visible link from php.net/downloads.php to the museum
and make a clear statement that PHP 4 has moved (I am sure there are
still many who look for it for application compatibiity reasons).
This to be done immediately?
A year may seem a long time but it isn't when a company has to port a
big application over. Also don't forget that one of the reasons so many
Again, the existing installation won't stop working or vanish anywhere on the
date we stop support and don't release new versions of it.. :)
--Jani
See below:
-----Original Message-----
From: Jani Taskinen [mailto:jani.taskinen@sci.fi]
Sent: Saturday, July 07, 2007 6:01 AM
To: Andi Gutmans
Cc: PHP Developers Mailing List
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?Andi Gutmans wrote:
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of
the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds
good and gives people about a year).Gives a year? Nice. Suddenly we've got some kind of time
machine here? :DIt's weird that people think of releases like the thing
suddenly vanishes from all servers it's installed on or it
stops working altogether when we're just saying that we drop
support for it. I wish that WAS possible...but unfortunately
people still can install it from existing tar balls..and it
will work just fine.
It's not the same. Not giving our users enough heads-up to plan, find
the resources, migrate, test and redeploy is what Microsoft does to its
users (ok so they do give some time but it's always too early and
upgrade path is often much harder). I think we owe it to our users to be
more friendly. For this time period they will require important bug
fixes especially security fixes so I think it ends up being good for
all.
Also don't forget once we make a statement like this, many people will
start planning their migration right away.
I also suggest to move PHP 4 downloads to the museum. I
suggest though
to make a clear visible link from php.net/downloads.php to
the museum
and make a clear statement that PHP 4 has moved (I am sure
there are
still many who look for it for application compatibiity reasons).This to be done immediately?
Yes, I think we should do this immediately and be sure to make it clear
where to get PHP 4 (clear message with clear visible link). But it will
still "feel" 2nd rate to users.
Andi
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).I also suggest to move PHP 4 downloads to the museum. I suggest though
to make a clear visible link from php.net/downloads.php to the museum
and make a clear statement that PHP 4 has moved (I am sure there are
still many who look for it for application compatibiity reasons).
A miracle, it seems like we're even reached consensus on this within a
day :) I'll be preparing the patches to implement this while I'll pass
by here.
And I checked the museum page views, there were 1.2 million of them
since april 20, 2006.
Derick
Derick Rethans
http://derickrethans.nl | http://ez.no | http://xdebug.org
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).
The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see, the idea is to
release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was released for this
first time.
I also suggest to move PHP 4 downloads to the museum. I suggest though
to make a clear visible link from php.net/downloads.php to the museum
and make a clear statement that PHP 4 has moved (I am sure there are
still many who look for it for application compatibiity reasons).
I think this is a bit premature - I suggest doing this at the end of the
year as the museum does not have MD5 sums and the like. I did add a
couple of lines in the patch for phpweb to point out this upcoming issue
though on both the downloads and releases pages.
Please have a look at the attached patch and feel free to make any
suggestions towards making the text better.
regards,
Derick
--
Derick Rethans
http://derickrethans.nl | http://ez.no | http://xdebug.org
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see, the idea is to
release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was released for this
first time.
First thanks for the patch!
This paragraph is confusing and somehow made my point:
+<p>
- Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will
- continue until the end of this year only. From 2007-12-31 there will be no
- more releases of PHP 4.4, besides important security releases. Security
- releases will continue until 2008-08-08 after which PHP 4.4 will no longer be
- supported officially. Please use the rest of this year to make your
- application suitable to run on PHP 5.
+</p>
Either we support it or we don't. That means we support it for
security problems only (all non sec bugs reported in php4 will be
bogused or move to php5+ if still present). That also means we will
have security release only until 2008-08-08.
I know that it is what this paragraph says but it could be clearer.
Something like:
- From 2008-01-01, only security fixes will be fixed (btw, there is no
"unimportant" security issue) - From 2008-08-08, PHP4 is dead, officially and physically
Is there a way to tell something like that in a non confusing way?
There is no need to hide the facts behind some form of kindness :-)
hth
Cheers,
--Pierre
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see, the idea is to
release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was released for this
first time.First thanks for the patch!
I changed the first two paragraphs to:
<p> Today it is exactly three years ago since PHP 5 has been released. In those three years it has seen many improvements over PHP 4. PHP 5 is fast, stable & production-ready and as PHP 6 is on the way, PHP 4 will be discontinued. </p> <p> Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will be no more releases of PHP 4.4. In case security issues might arise after this date, we will consider making security-only releases up to 2008-08-08. Please use the rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5. </p>I think that reads better.
Derick
My 2 cents...
<p> As of XX-XX-2007, it will have been 3 years since the release of PHP 5. In these 3 years many improvements have been implemented over PHP 4 and PHP 5 can now be considered fast, stable & production ready. With PHP 6 in active development PHP 4 development will now be discontinued. </p> <p> Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will be discontinued as of 2007-12-31, after this date there will be no more releases of PHP 4.4. Security issue's found in PHP 4.4 after this date will be evaluated for severity and the development team will consider relasing security updates until 2008-08-08. Please use the rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5. </p>Regards
Marco
I wouldn't say "consider" in releasing security fixes. I would say that
we won't make any more releases except in cases of security bugs.
Andi
-----Original Message-----
From: Derick Rethans [mailto:derick@php.net]
Sent: Tuesday, July 10, 2007 12:34 AM
To: Pierre
Cc: PHP Developers Mailing List
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4?I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the
year we plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except
for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it
sounds good and gives people about a year).The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see,
the idea is
to release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was
released for
this first time.First thanks for the patch!
I changed the first two paragraphs to:
<p> Today it is exactly three years ago since PHP 5 has been released. In those three years it has seen many improvements over PHP 4. PHP 5 is fast, stable & production-ready and as PHP 6 is on the way, PHP 4 will be discontinued. </p> <p> Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will be no more releases of PHP 4.4. In case security issues might arise after this date, we will consider making security-only releases up to 2008-08-08. Please use the rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5. </p>I think that reads better.
Derick
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I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested:
a) We make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year we
plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security fixes.
b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8 (because it sounds good
and gives people about a year).The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see, the idea is to
release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was released for this
first time.First thanks for the patch!
I changed the first two paragraphs to:
<p> Today it is exactly three years ago since PHP 5 has been released. In those three years it has seen many improvements over PHP 4. PHP 5 is fast, stable & production-ready and as PHP 6 is on the way, PHP 4 will be discontinued. </p> <p> Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will be no more releases of PHP 4.4. In case security issues might arise after this date, we will consider making security-only releases up to 2008-08-08. Please use the rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5. </p>I think that reads better.
It is perfect, well done :)
Merci!
--Pierre
I'd suggest something close to what Rasmus suggested: a) We
make a clear statement on PHP.net that at the end of the year
we plan to discontinue bug fixes for PHP 4 except for security
fixes. b) We will discontinue supporting PHP 4 on 8/8/8
(because it sounds good and gives people about a year).The attached patch mentions the above. As you can see, the idea
is to release this on the 13th, 3 years after php 5 was released
for this first time.First thanks for the patch!
I changed the first two paragraphs to:
<p> Today it is exactly three years ago since PHP 5 has been released. In those three years it has seen many improvements over PHP 4. PHP 5 is fast, stable & production-ready and as PHP 6 is on the way, PHP 4 will be discontinued. </p> <p> Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will be no more releases of PHP 4.4. In case security issues might arise after this date, we will consider making security-only releases up to 2008-08-08. Please use the rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5. </p>I think that reads better.
It is perfect, well done :)
Almost, I want to change the 2nd paragraph to:
Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will
continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will
be no more releases of PHP 4.4. We will continue to make critical security
fixes available on a case-by-case basis until 2008-08-08. Please use the
rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5.
regards,
Derick
Almost, I want to change the 2nd paragraph to:
Hereby the PHP development team announces that support for PHP 4 will
continue until the end of this year only. After 2007-12-31 there will
be no more releases of PHP 4.4. We will continue to make critical
security
fixes available on a case-by-case basis until 2008-08-08. Please use
the
rest of this year to make your application suitable to run on PHP 5.
Looks good to me!
Regards
Marco
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