Hello,
First of all, thank you for php. Secondly, I hope this doesn't come
across as impertinent.
I'm an average user of php. I don't know enough about programming
languages to contribute
here; but I do try and keep up with what's going on in the php core.
I was curious what the userland view of scalar type hints was, so I
set up a two question
SurveyMonkey poll asking about the current RFC. To be clear, I don't
think php should be
a democracy; I am not intending to somehow subvert the RFC process.
As I see it, you all
have rather difficult judgements to make about the language, and those
decisions may have
far-reaching consequences. But I do wonder if 'what do php users
think' might be a useful
additional data point for you when making those judgements.
The first question was 'Did you read the RFC' and the second 'Would
you like the RFC to
pass'. I set it up Friday morning (GMT) and tweeted it around a bit
(I have a grand total
of 58 followers on twitter). So this relates to version 0.3
As of now, 306 people have responded, a lot more than I anticipated.
84% said they read
the RFC; > 83% would like it to pass (full responses here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/results/SM-Q8KRRZV7/, the survey itself here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/SDB2V6Z).
I hope this is helpful.
[About the survey].
Settings on Survey Monkey were: randomised order of answers to Q2; one
response only.
I tweeted it, and @ tweeted a few people that I noticed talking about the RFC.
I think it got forwarded on a bit.
Possible problems with it:
- Not enough responses / it's not representative?
- I'd be happy if others with more prominent twitter presences (let's
face it, that's
not hard) wanted to publicise it. Although if it goes over 1000
responses I'd have
to stump up a load more cash to SurveyMonkey, so I hope 1000 would be enough ;)
- It doesn't contain any information. Everyone knows we all want
scalar type hints,
but a similar result would have been gained with a completely
different approach.
The problem isn't "whether to", it's "how best to", and it's unlikely that those
polled understand the trade-offs.
- Possibly. Again, I'm surprised by the number of responses, and the
numbers both
reading the RFC and wanting it. To me, the strongest message is 'please get
something into php 7'. Watching all this from the outside, I worry
that this will
not be the outcome.
Hi Matt and all,
The first question was 'Did you read the RFC' and the second 'Would
you like the RFC to
pass'. I set it up Friday morning (GMT) and tweeted it around a bit
(I have a grand total
of 58 followers on twitter). So this relates to version 0.3As of now, 306 people have responded, a lot more than I anticipated.
84% said they read
the RFC; > 83% would like it to pass (full responses here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/results/SM-Q8KRRZV7/, the survey itself here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/SDB2V6Z).
They don't know about DbC discussion probably.
I thought we were no where near to implement DbC, so I was willing to vote
+1 initially.
However, DbC is coming close!
DbC brings much more flexibility, strict/loose constraints, performance,
security, better documentation and more.
DbC suitable for weakly typed PHP perfectly.
Therefore, I'm holding my vote now.
I hope everyone have an attention to DbC and consider thoughtfully.
Regards,
--
Yasuo Ohgaki
yohgaki@ohgaki.net
Hi Matt and all,
On Mon, Feb 9, 2015 at 6:52 AM, Matt Parker matt@lamplightdb.co.uk
wrote:The first question was 'Did you read the RFC' and the second 'Would
you like the RFC to
pass'. I set it up Friday morning (GMT) and tweeted it around a bit
(I have a grand total
of 58 followers on twitter). So this relates to version 0.3As of now, 306 people have responded, a lot more than I anticipated.
84% said they read
the RFC; > 83% would like it to pass (full responses here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/results/SM-Q8KRRZV7/, the survey itself
here:
https://www.surveymonkey.com/s/SDB2V6Z).They don't know about DbC discussion probably.
I thought we were no where near to implement DbC, so I was willing to vote
+1 initially.However, DbC is coming close!
DbC brings much more flexibility, strict/loose constraints, performance,
security, better documentation and more.
DbC suitable for weakly typed PHP perfectly.Therefore, I'm holding my vote now.
I hope everyone have an attention to DbC and consider thoughtfully.
Imho they are totally different things.
One is a core root feature (scalar "hinting").
Then we have annotations, which can be used(and is very often used for
contracts) by DbC.
However starting to stop one in favor of another is a strategic mistake.
I left alone the DbC or annotations as phpdoc as we have discussed that to
death already :)
Cheers,
Pierre
De : Pierre Joye [mailto:pierre.php@gmail.com]
However, DbC is coming close!
DbC brings much more flexibility, strict/loose constraints, performance,
security, better documentation and more.
DbC suitable for weakly typed PHP perfectly.Therefore, I'm holding my vote now.
I hope everyone have an attention to DbC and consider thoughtfully.Imho they are totally different things.
You're right. That's two different things in the way they are implemented. But they are also closely related because both approaches propose an element of solution to similar needs: reduce coding errors.
Then, depending on their own position about strict types, people will consider it as just a complement, or as a whole alternative. I agree on one thing, we mustn't mix both discussions :)
Cheers
François
De : Pierre Joye [mailto:pierre.php@gmail.com]
However, DbC is coming close!
DbC brings much more flexibility, strict/loose constraints,
performance,
security, better documentation and more.
DbC suitable for weakly typed PHP perfectly.Therefore, I'm holding my vote now.
I hope everyone have an attention to DbC and consider thoughtfully.Imho they are totally different things.
You're right. That's two different things in the way they are
implemented. But they are also closely related because both approaches
propose an element of solution to similar needs: reduce coding errors.Then, depending on their own position about strict types, people will
consider it as just a complement, or as a whole alternative. I agree on one
thing, we mustn't mix both discussions :)
It is not what I am saying.
Let me try with a fictional example.
Let say we have a RFC about adding support to comments in code. Yes, simple
comments.
Now what has been said here is that he suspends his vote because there is
other working on adding phpdoc. And comparing DbC with type hinting is
light years different.