RFC [Discussion]: Closure self-reference View as Markdown

On Sun, Jun 4, 2023 at 12:06 PM Juliette Reinders Folmer <
php-internals_nospam@adviesenzo.nl> wrote:

When I read the RFC, I keep wondering why new syntax is needed for this.
Isn't this a solved problem with the solution being "use a named function"
?

I think that's a bit harsh - couldn't we say that about any limitation of
closures, or any proposed improvement to closure handling? "Just use a
named function" doesn't seem like a fair critique when the usefulness of
closures isn't in question, or the fact that people do use closures.

Might I suggest to expand the RFC to answer all or at least some of the
below questions ?

• Why is a recursive function call something which should be supported
  at the language level for closures ?

It seems a reasonable expectation that the functional capability of
closures should as closely match named functions as possible, doesn't it?
Or at least that whatever limitations they have don't lead to runtime
surprises like the example given in the RFC.

As for the syntax choice: it seems like the proposed choice is largely
arbitrary and personal to the authors to go for a "languagesy" syntax.

• Was any research done on how frequently this is expected to be used ?
• If so, does that frequency justify the need for a change at the
  language level ?
• Was any research done to find out syntax preferences from anyone other
  than the authors ?

• Was the impact of introducing (yet another) syntax level change on

static analysis tools considered ?

I think there was a fair bit of discussion about syntax choice in the
previous thread (which was a long time ago now) but the point about impact
on static analysis tools is valid and relevant. That said, there is an
argument that it's for ecosystem tools to adapt to changes in the language,
not for the language to orient itself to the convenience of those tools.

Still, I suppose we do have a special case with static analysis tools in
particular over other stock userland libraries, because these tools in
particular serve to fill gaps in PHP's limitations as a dynamic language,
so I think your point about reconsidering syntax choice in respect of
making adaptation easier is worth the RFC authors considering further.

I think for users, the proposed choice with the "as" keyword is the most
natural. A recursive closure is probably an extremely rare thing to do
whatever way you cut it, though, so if the syntax for users is a little
uglier but it makes some other aspect such as what you've raised above
easier, I can see the justification for choosing one of the other options,
probably a constant like CLOSURE.

Anyway, although I can't vote, +1 from me in principle on the feature,
syntax TBC. It closes a very small gap but a gap all the same.

-Dave

On Mon, 5 Jun 2023 at 05:09, Alexandru Pătrănescu drealecs@gmail.com
wrote:

How about a keyword/variable to the current executing closure that works
also if you refactor it to a function or a method.
Just like self for a class we can have a keyword like fnself [..]

This seems quite appealing to me, and is imho more idiomatic and ergonomic
than the other proposals.

Keywords naturally avoid conflicts with user variables, and remove the need
for each author to pick a name for their closure and the inevitable
preferences, automation, and disagreements that will arise from that.

On the other hand, we've seen from match() how disruptive a new keyword
can be as they clash as well, with function names instead of variables.
Building on an existing keyword or soft-reserved naming convention would
avoid that.

In terms of global constants, we have double underscores which is in the
proposal already but feels unnatural as others have indicated already.

In terms of local constants, I believe we authors generally prefer
uppercase names, and we have one built-in special constant that's
lowercase: self::class.

Perhaps self::fn or self::callee?

The latter borrows the closure terminology form JavaScript
(arguments.callee, which does the same thing).

--
Timo Tijhof
https://timotijhof.net/

Hello you all.

As closures are objects, I'd be ok with $this->__invoke(), but it's not
possible because closures can be bound to other contexts.
From the proposed solutions, the one that makes more sense to me is the
CLOSURE, because not only it does not need
the boilerplate that can be confusing about the usage of "use/as" but it
also shouts out for the ones reading the code that this
function is calling itself.

Best regards,
Erick

Em ter., 6 de jun. de 2023 às 11:26, Bruce Weirdan weirdan@gmail.com
escreveu:

I'm now opening the discussion for the Closure self-reference RFC:
https://wiki.php.net/rfc/closure_self_reference

Looking at the syntax options on the RFC page, the following
explanation is not clear to me:

• De-anonymize the function. This has a large aesthetic downside of
  appearing to create the closure variable in the scope that the closure is
  declared in, rather than internal to the closure scope.

Does this mean that the variable wouldn't actually be created in the
enclosing scope, but someone may think it would?

--
Best regards,
Bruce Weirdan mailto:
weirdan@gmail.com

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