# RIP PHP 4? - Thread: https://externals.io/message/30508 - Original archive: https://news-web.php.net/php.internals/30508 - Started by Derick Rethans on 2007-07-06T14:32:50+00:00 - Messages: 68 - Page 1 of 3: messages 1 to 25 (25 per page, add `?page=N` to the URL) - Next page: https://externals.io/message/30508.md?page=2 - Reply by email to internals@lists.php.net - More for agents: search with https://externals.io/search.md?q={query} · JSON API at https://externals.io/api · documentation at https://externals.io/llms.txt --- ## #30508 — Derick Rethans — 2007-07-06T14:32:50+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30508 Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are allowed)! regards, Derick --- ## #30509 — David Coallier — 2007-07-06T14:41:52+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30509 · In reply to: #30508 +1 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick > > -- > > > > -- David Coallier, Founder & Software Architect, Agora Production (http://agoraproduction.com) 51.42.06.70.18 --- ## #30510 — Tijnema — 2007-07-06T14:42:55+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30510 · In reply to: #30508 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick > > -- > > > > +1 -- Vote for PHP Color Coding in Gmail! -> http://gpcc.tijnema.info --- ## #30511 — Antony Dovgal — 2007-07-06T14:43:09+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30511 · In reply to: #30508 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! +1 (goes celebrating..) -- Wbr, Antony Dovgal --- ## #30512 — Jeremy Privett — 2007-07-06T14:43:37+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30512 · In reply to: #30508 +1 -----Original Message----- From: Derick Rethans [mailto:derick@php.net] Sent: Friday, July 06, 2007 8:33 AM To: PHP Developers Mailing List Subject: [PHP-DEV] RIP PHP 4? Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are allowed)! regards, Derick --- ## #30514 — Alain Williams — 2007-07-06T14:45:36+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30514 · In reply to: #30508 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! +1 -- Alain Williams Linux Consultant - Mail systems, Web sites, Networking, Programmer, IT Lecturer. +44 (0) 787 668 0256 http://www.phcomp.co.uk/ Parliament Hill Computers Ltd. Registration Information: http://www.phcomp.co.uk/contact.php #include Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick --- ## #30516 — Richard Quadling — 2007-07-06T14:47:42+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30516 · In reply to: #30508 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick +1 -- ----- Richard Quadling Zend Certified Engineer : http://zend.com/zce.php?c=ZEND002498&r=213474731 "Standing on the shoulders of some very clever giants!" --- ## #30517 — Sebastian Bergmann — 2007-07-06T14:47:54+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30517 · In reply to: #30508 Derick Rethans schrieb: > Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are allowed)! +1 -- Sebastian Bergmann http://sebastian-bergmann.de/ GnuPG Key: 0xB85B5D69 / 27A7 2B14 09E4 98CD 6277 0E5B 6867 C514 B85B 5D69 --- ## #30518 — Scott MacVicar — 2007-07-06T14:49:38+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30518 · In reply to: #30508 Derick Rethans wrote: > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick > +1 (It's been a long time coming.) Scott --- ## #30519 — Vesselin Kenashkov — 2007-07-06T14:51:34+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30519 · In reply to: #30510 -1 Because the majority of the installation (somebody two month ago in this list mentioned that php 5 has just 10% adoption) is still php4 just makes no sense to drop the support. I see (and understand) both the desire of the developers and the objective reasons for the rush on the new versions, and I would propose to drop php4 when php6 is out. Then, probably, because of the new features in v6 the v4 users will consider migration (and then will become obvious that php4 soon will be and has to be dropped). So I would vote +1 if it was not "at the end of the year" but instead, "when php6 is released" (or if you have strict plan to do this release before the end of this year, then count my vote as +1). --- ## #30520 — Robert Cummings — 2007-07-06T15:00:26+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30520 · In reply to: #30519 > -1 > Because the majority of the installation (somebody two month ago in this > list mentioned that php 5 has just 10% adoption) is still php4 just makes no > sense to drop the support. I see (and understand) both the desire of the > developers and the objective reasons for the rush on the new versions, and I > would propose to drop php4 when php6 is out. Then, probably, because of the > new features in v6 the v4 users will consider migration (and then will > become obvious that php4 soon will be and has to be dropped). > So I would vote +1 if it was not "at the end of the year" but instead, "when > php6 is released" (or if you have strict plan to do this release before the > end of this year, then count my vote as +1). +1 Because as Derick mentioned, there would still be security fixes. Cheers, Rob. -- .------------------------------------------------------------. | InterJinn Application Framework - http://www.interjinn.com | :------------------------------------------------------------: | An application and templating framework for PHP. Boasting | | a powerful, scalable system for accessing system services | | such as forms, properties, sessions, and caches. InterJinn | | also provides an extremely flexible architecture for | | creating re-usable components quickly and easily. | `------------------------------------------------------------' --- ## #30521 — Lester Caine — 2007-07-06T15:00:35+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30521 · In reply to: #30508 Derick Rethans wrote: > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! +1 -- Lester Caine - G8HFL ----------------------------- Contact - http://home.lsces.co.uk/lsces/wiki/?page=contact L.S.Caine Electronic Services - http://home.lsces.co.uk MEDW - http://home.lsces.co.uk/ModelEngineersDigitalWorkshop/ Firebird - http://www.firebirdsql.org/index.php --- ## #30522 — johannes@php.net — 2007-07-06T15:04:12+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30522 · In reply to: #30508 +1 > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick --- ## #30523 — Rasmus Lerdorf — 2007-07-06T15:07:29+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30523 · In reply to: #30508 Derick Rethans wrote: > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! I'm breaking your vote only rule. I don't really understand what dropping support means if we will still release security fixes. That's the mode we have been in for at least a year, so what would change at the end of the year? Dropping support to me means PHP 4 becomes like PHP 3. No new releases for any reason, and I don't think we can realistically do that yet. Saying we are dropping support and then continuing on with the status quo seems odd to me. -Rasmus --- ## #30524 — Brian Moon — 2007-07-06T15:09:28+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30524 · In reply to: #30508 Derick Rethans wrote: > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick > +1 -- Brian Moon Senior Developer ------------------------------ http://dealnews.com/ It's good to be cheap =) --- ## #30525 — Antony Dovgal — 2007-07-06T15:22:35+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30525 · In reply to: #30523 > I'm breaking your vote only rule. I don't really understand what > dropping support means if we will still release security fixes. That's > the mode we have been in for at least a year, so what would change at > the end of the year? > > Dropping support to me means PHP 4 becomes like PHP 3. No new releases > for any reason, and I don't think we can realistically do that yet. > Saying we are dropping support and then continuing on with the status > quo seems odd to me. To me it means in the first place that we can add a canned answer to the bugtracker which would say "PHP4 is not supported anymore, install PHP5" and close all PHP4 only reports. So no bug-fixes, no releases except for ones fixing critical security problems. And even that should be ceased either in say.. 1 or 2 years. -- Wbr, Antony Dovgal --- ## #30528 — Mikko Koppanen — 2007-07-06T15:42:18+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30528 · In reply to: #30508 +1 -- Mikko Koppanen > > Ladies, Gentlemen, Kings and Princesses, > > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security > issues, we have to as the install base is too large, but that would be > the only thing that would warrant a new release. I already sort of > mentioned this on april 1st, but I think we should come with a slightly > more official statement. Your votes please (only -1 and +1 are > allowed)! > > regards, > Derick --- ## #30529 — Stanislav Malyshev — 2007-07-06T15:48:30+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30529 · In reply to: #30508 > With the nice PHP 5 / PHP 6 unicode semantics thread under way I am > trying to gauge what people feel about dropping support for PHP 4 at the > end of this year. That does not mean that we will not fix security -1. We still need to do security fixes, and I think we still need to do important non-security fixes too. And that's more or less what we are doing now, so no "dropping" is possible while keeping that. -- Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect stas@zend.com http://www.zend.com/ (408)253-8829 MSN: stas@zend.com --- ## #30530 — Stefan Priebsch — 2007-07-06T15:49:10+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30530 · In reply to: #30508 +1 -- >e-novative> - We make IT work for you. e-novative GmbH - HR: Amtsgericht München HRB 139407 Sitz: Wolfratshausen - GF: Dipl. Inform. Stefan Priebsch http://www.e-novative.de --- ## #30531 — Rasmus Lerdorf — 2007-07-06T15:58:42+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30531 · In reply to: #30525 Antony Dovgal wrote: > > > […] > > To me it means in the first place that we can add a canned answer to the > bugtracker which would say "PHP4 is not supported anymore, install PHP5" > and close all PHP4 only reports. > > So no bug-fixes, no releases except for ones fixing critical security > problems. > And even that should be ceased either in say.. 1 or 2 years. When was the last time we did a PHP4-only bug fix? My fear is that the impact of the no-more-support statement is hurt when we qualify it with the fact that nothing is really changing. I'd be more in favour of a statement that put a final death date on it which means no new releases of any sort. We could still say security-fixes only by the end of the year and then death by 08/08/08 or something like that. -Rasmus --- ## #30532 — Antony Dovgal — 2007-07-06T16:06:50+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30532 · In reply to: #30531 > > […] > > When was the last time we did a PHP4-only bug fix? Doesn't matter, we still have many of PHP4-only reports which nobody is going to look in anyway. Also it wasn't that long ago: - Fixed bug #38798 (OpenSSL init corrected in php5 but not in php4). (Tony) > My fear is that the impact of the no-more-support statement is hurt when > we qualify it with the fact that nothing is really changing. Well, I explained what should change in the first place - no more PHP4 reports. If you're unable to reproduce it with PHP5 - sorry, we can't help you. > I'd be more in favour of a statement that put a final death date on it > which means no new releases of any sort. We could still say > security-fixes only by the end of the year and then death by 08/08/08 or > something like that. Yup, that's exactly what I said in my e-mail. -- Wbr, Antony Dovgal --- ## #30533 — David Coallier — 2007-07-06T16:09:12+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30533 · In reply to: #30532 > > > […] > > Doesn't matter, we still have many of PHP4-only reports which nobody is going to look in anyway. > Also it wasn't that long ago: > - Fixed bug #38798 (OpenSSL init corrected in php5 but not in php4). (Tony) > > > […] > > Well, I explained what should change in the first place - no more PHP4 reports. > If you're unable to reproduce it with PHP5 - sorry, we can't help you. > > > […] > Well the initial question was to drop it but not kill it, if there would be another vote for killing it completely, I am totally 100% for it. 21st century... moving on. > Yup, that's exactly what I said in my e-mail. > > -- > Wbr, > Antony Dovgal > > -- > > > > -- David Coallier, Founder & Software Architect, Agora Production (http://agoraproduction.com) 51.42.06.70.18 --- ## #30534 — Jani Taskinen — 2007-07-06T16:30:06+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30534 · In reply to: #30531 Nevermind the wording, just as soon as we just put a notice on php.net that the "end is near, prepare yourselves" the sooner hosting companies, etc. realize the end is really near.. :) I'd be more for dropping all support whatsoever by the end of this year and focus totally on PHP 5/6. Critical security fixes are another issue altogether. --Jani Rasmus Lerdorf kirjoitti: > Antony Dovgal wrote: > > […] > > When was the last time we did a PHP4-only bug fix? > > My fear is that the impact of the no-more-support statement is hurt when > we qualify it with the fact that nothing is really changing. > > I'd be more in favour of a statement that put a final death date on it > which means no new releases of any sort. We could still say > security-fixes only by the end of the year and then death by 08/08/08 or > something like that. > > -Rasmus --- ## #30541 — Christopher Jones — 2007-07-06T16:41:49+00:00 URL: https://externals.io/message/30508#30541 · In reply to: #30531 Rasmus Lerdorf wrote: > I'd be more in favour of a statement that put a final death date on it > which means no new releases of any sort. We could still say > security-fixes only by the end of the year and then death by 08/08/08 or > something like that. +1 The final PHP 4 patch date should be relative to the release date of PHP 6, e.g. 6 months after PHP 6 is released. -- Christopher Jones, Oracle Email: christopher.jones@oracle.com Tel: +1 650 506 8630 Blog: http://blogs.oracle.com/opal/ PHP Book: http://tinyurl.com/f8jad --- Next page: https://externals.io/message/30508.md?page=2