Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:88265 Return-Path: Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 61054 invoked from network); 16 Sep 2015 21:37:16 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 16 Sep 2015 21:37:16 -0000 Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=rowan.collins@gmail.com; spf=pass; sender-id=pass Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=rowan.collins@gmail.com; sender-id=pass Received-SPF: pass (pb1.pair.com: domain gmail.com designates 209.85.212.169 as permitted sender) X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: rowan.collins@gmail.com X-Host-Fingerprint: 209.85.212.169 mail-wi0-f169.google.com Received: from [209.85.212.169] ([209.85.212.169:35965] helo=mail-wi0-f169.google.com) by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP id 68/D3-41443-C01E9F55 for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2015 17:37:16 -0400 Received: by wicgb1 with SMTP id gb1so92518267wic.1 for ; Wed, 16 Sep 2015 14:37:13 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=user-agent:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :content-transfer-encoding:content-type:subject:from:date:to :message-id; bh=SS7jXuYRzXe9egZWD0VJdueLsmUAGZz44tlOrH5ZjoM=; b=AqFXj4MIvCEbw9nT5t9gIMQcztWi2m/e/JeHg2ETtL7ROtsn+b/WLHBFrldiXgXHN3 26e6JrSiW5wU7Z22JTne1I/pLNWgzZkTsiWfzSjj9V5Kr3XTc2+KOmDX6YX/3t4J1pDj Jw7LtbD+ZepyVU3a4Rlo0DFsvi+7nacmS28z6ayFB5G9O4ovUgR9KhZIHqE1+s4XpCbg JrBig7fTFDHJnR2iqnVPVRtXWwLQL+RS4gt8Mm9y1equtf05XIplKdvNthx5sRGdAj7X 590PKGCxvxVvWkrD68f7ooozF2t9BCgvjeFHCMnmH+ivMwRrvKzL53DxvRu0p2TDF30C Xd4A== X-Received: by 10.194.114.37 with SMTP id jd5mr25320252wjb.34.1442439433490; Wed, 16 Sep 2015 14:37:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: from [192.168.0.6] (cpc68956-brig15-2-0-cust215.3-3.cable.virginm.net. [82.6.24.216]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id pk7sm16778659wjb.2.2015.09.16.14.37.12 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=OTHER); Wed, 16 Sep 2015 14:37:13 -0700 (PDT) User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android In-Reply-To: <55F9D704.5050002@lsces.co.uk> References: <55DE0907.6040904@gmail.com> <1F615BCD-1B9B-4C51-A210-869F1AA1F6E3@craigfrancis.co.uk> <55E5EBBF.6020803@gmail.com> <0BA3A129-D356-4781-B6DE-E2B5A7924AE2@craigfrancis.co.uk> <55E6EC36.6090301@gmail.com> <9AF329EC-99A5-412D-A52B-432627A5520F@gmail.com> <6F4D91EE-B56E-4B83-B1AF-598C3F6897FC@craigfrancis.co.uk> <55F07BA4.2000204@gmail.com> <55F6B911.9080400@gmail.com> <96BE7F01-D04B-483B-B1A3-B45CED6DFCDC@craigfrancis.co.uk> <55F6F08C.1020506@gmail.com> <0BEF6D82-CB5F-49F6-A3A4-3267924A0CDA@thesba.com> <55F72CA9.2060301@gmail.com> <09369945-76FE-4E08-9C2C-15FB0577AD27@thesba.com> <55F752E7.9070801@gmail.com> <55F9B4C7.3050700@gmail.com> <440C64A2-4B4F-4AEF-ACE3-F3A6637EBAB6@thesba.com> <55F9D704.5050002@lsces.co.uk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Date: Wed, 16 Sep 2015 22:23:25 +0100 To: Lester Caine ,internals@lists.php.net Message-ID: Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] PHP 7.1 - Address PHPSadness #28? From: rowan.collins@gmail.com (Rowan Collins) On 16 September 2015 21:54:28 BST, Lester Caine wrote: > 'exists but I don't know what >as yet' is a logical state It is indeed. "I know it's name but it doesn't exist", however, is generally not a valid state - if you've hard-coded the name (as is the case with 99.9% of bare variables) then clearly you consider it to have some existence. For this reason, PHP assumes that you meant to create it with a null value. I seem to remember Perl has an interesting quirk along these lines where in some circumstances just reading from a variable will actually initialise it in memory! Regards, -- Rowan Collins [IMSoP]