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Date: Wed, 01 Apr 2015 20:20:12 +0000
Message-ID: <CAHXmDMCYa78obsq7Nnm827itsC6fYKo4c=Sr1Ut4Qj96LBNBOA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Dennis Birkholz <dennis@birkholz.biz>, Stanislav Malyshev <smalyshev@gmail.com>, internals@lists.php.net
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] What's our official stance on small self-contained
 additions in a micro version
From: rican7@gmail.com (Trevor Suarez)

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Damn Gmail... I just top-posted. I'm going to go away for a while now...

On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 4:19 PM Trevor Suarez <rican7@gmail.com> wrote:

> Author of PR https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/1145 here.
>
> I'm really quite sorry. I didn't mean to create a mess here. I was just
> trying to contribute. :/
>
> Unfortunately, whether or not an RFC was necessary for an addition like
> this wasn't very clear. I'm an internals noob, so I simply tried to follow
> the flow of the addition of the similar method
> `DateTimeImmutable::createFromMutable()` that was added, without RFC
> (correct me if I'm wrong), in 5.6.0:
> http://php.net/manual/en/datetimeimmutable.createfrommutable.php
>
> Unfortunately, I'm not a huge fan of Derick's `createFromMutable()`
> method (why isn't there just a `createFromInstance()` or `copy()` method of
> some sort), but I tried to best follow the current design with my proposal
> and pull request.
>
> I think some clarification regarding what does or does-not require an RFC
> would make it much more helpful to contributors that want to help build PHP.
>
> Again, sorry if I caused any issue here.
>
> - Trevor
>
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 4:09 PM Dennis Birkholz <dennis@birkholz.biz>
> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Am 01.04.2015 um 21:43 schrieb Stanislav Malyshev:
>> >> That is right and I think that is the reality we have to face: most
>> >> users use distro versions. They get a new version when they need to
>> >> upgrade their distro every few years.
>> >
>> > I'm not sure where you got this statistics from, but as I said, it is
>> > very easy to make .rpm or .deb with source version from php.net of the
>> > same minor. I've seen it done many times. It's next to impossible to
>> > make the same with different major, and nobody would do it for obvious
>> > stability concerns. I think the approach of "you have to wait several
>> > years for any tiny change" is terrible and detrimental for PHP
>> > development, however easy it makes the life of folks in Debian, etc.
>>
>> I vaguely remembered the usage statistics that Anthony assembled in
>> December and had other numbers in my head. (see
>> http://blog.ircmaxell.com/2014/12/php-install-statistics.html)
>>
>> 5.5.12 (Ubuntu 14.10): 0.16%
>> 5.5.9 (Ubuntu 14.04): 1.81%
>> 5.4.16 (CentOS 7.0): 0.42%
>> 5.4.4 (Debian Wheezy): 2.14%
>> 5.3.10 (Ubuntu 12.04): 4.13%
>> 5.3.3 (Debian Squeeze, Centos 6.6): 10.37%
>> 5.3.2 (Ubuntu 10.04): 1.06%
>> 5.1.6 (CentOS 5.11): 1.14%
>> ==============================
>> Debian, Ubuntu and CentOS: ~21,23%
>>
>> (I assume here like Anthony that the installs matching a distribution
>> specific version always come from that distribution).
>>
>> So I have to step a little back from my previous statement, only about
>> 1/5th of the installs seem to use distribution installs. But there are a
>> lot of used versions in between. Why they don't upgrade I don't know,
>> but if the upgrade would be a no-brainer without any risk for
>> incompatibility, probably more would upgrade, but that is just
>> speculation.
>>
>> >> No, I don't say ban non-security bugfixes. But I say don't add new
>> >> methods/functionality that should go in the next feature release.
>> >
>> > I'm fine with adding only those that should go into the current one,
>> > namely small self-contained additions :) Just as we agreed on long ago.
>>
>> An addition and a bug fix are different things.
>>
>> Greets
>> Dennis
>>
>> --
>> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
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>>
>>

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