Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:84964
Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm
Received-SPF: pass (pb1.pair.com: domain gmail.com designates 209.85.218.50 as permitted sender)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Sender: yohgaki@gmail.com
In-Reply-To: <CAAyV7nFAE07s+o8xW6fYwAu2-goo3riWuuWSTZn4hTo5O58HrA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAyV7nFAE07s+o8xW6fYwAu2-goo3riWuuWSTZn4hTo5O58HrA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2015 10:40:36 +0900
Message-ID: <CAGa2bXZrmQuzCTQ=E8gkGU-N2wV459PfL2VCdmeu_+JQD17LEQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Anthony Ferrara <ircmaxell@gmail.com>
Cc: "internals@lists.php.net" <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=089e0163514038463c05115df286
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC][Status] Scalar Type Declarations Voting Date Change
From: yohgaki@ohgaki.net (Yasuo Ohgaki)

--089e0163514038463c05115df286
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

Hi Anthony,

On Mon, Mar 16, 2015 at 6:33 AM, Anthony Ferrara <ircmaxell@gmail.com>
wrote:

> I have decided to close the vote on my Scalar type declarations RFC.
>
> When I added the wording "or the date that voting closes on a
> competing RFC." to the voting timeline of the RFC, it was in the
> understanding that it was a good faith effort on the part of Zeev and
> the competing RFC for the best of the project. I was advised against
> doing so by several people. I still chose to show the good faith and
> attempt to work with people rather than against them.
>
> However, it has become exceedingly clear to me that this good faith
> has not been reciprocated. The understanding that we had when both
> proposals opened has now been violated. Rules have been broken and
> politics are ensuing in an attempt to sabotage this proposal. Rather
> than working together, "unofficial polls", backdoor politics and poor
> behavior have created yet more toxicity.
>
> For this reason, I consider the good-faith clause violated.
>
> Rather than drag this vote on end, and rather than be accused of
> closing "when convenient", I am choosing to move up the ending day to
> put an end to the drama.
>
> Therefore, I am closing votes on this RFC effective tomorrow, March 16th.
>
> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/scalar_type_hints_v5#vote
>

The most serious issue of this RFC is

 - It hides bugs that should be fixed in both weak and strict hint mode.

The reason why we would like to have scalar type hints is to "eliminate
type related bugs", not "hiding type related bugs".

Bugs will be hidden with this proposal. I'm sure this is not what you want
and almost all of us does not want if not all.

Coercive type for general developers and strict type for library developers
will
eliminate more type related bugs, more natural to average PHP users. IMHO.

It's natural that we have different point of views, but we can easily
understand/guess
the consequence of the RFC. Weak mode is simply too weak to be useful.
Strict mode will hide type bugs by errorless casts.

I hope both you and Zeev work together to satisfy most needs because
hiding bugs are not good thing to do.

Regards,

--
Yasuo Ohgaki
yohgaki@ohgaki.net

--089e0163514038463c05115df286--