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Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2015 22:59:24 +0000
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To: Zeev Suraski <zeev@zend.com>
Cc: Anthony Ferrara <ircmaxell@gmail.com>, 
	"internals@lists.php.net" <internals@lists.php.net>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC][Status] Scalar Type Declarations Voting Date Change
From: padraic.brady@gmail.com (=?UTF-8?Q?P=C3=A1draic_Brady?=)

On 15 March 2015 at 21:58, Zeev Suraski <zeev@zend.com> wrote:
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Anthony Ferrara [mailto:ircmaxell@gmail.com]
>> Sent: Sunday, March 15, 2015 11:34 PM
>> To: internals@lists.php.net
>> Subject: [PHP-DEV] [RFC][Status] Scalar Type Declarations Voting Date
>> Change
>>
>> However, it has become exceedingly clear to me that this good faith has
>> not
>> been reciprocated. The understanding that we had when both proposals
>> opened has now been violated. Rules have been broken and politics are
>> ensuing in an attempt to sabotage this proposal. Rather than working
>> together, "unofficial polls", backdoor politics and poor behavior have
>> created yet more toxicity.
>
> Anthony,
>
> Stop accusing me of refusing to work together, backdoor politics and poor
> behavior:
>
> - Refusing to work together:  I tried to support numerous ways to evaluat=
e
> Bob's RFC, all of which were opposed by you or other Dual STH supporters,
> for technicalities - valid or not.

Those "technicalities" were basic rules and a PHP7 timeline that
everyone was following, until someone invented new "technicalities"
one after the other in an attempt to get past the original
"technicalities". The attempt has not even succeeded which means we
can have a bit of comfort that they'll continue to be upheld.

I'm sorry, but regardless of any honest intent on your part (and I
don't doubt you honestly want to give the RFC a fair go), selectively
working very actively to get around the rules and timeline will
inevitably appear highly unilateral, political and abusive to others,
especially when you complain about others opposing the attempt and
it's literally just you doing it. You have fired that appearance up
whether you perceive it as deserved or not. You keep calling out
technicalities and complaining/criticising or misdirecting whenever
someone questions you on them, and that dismissive attitude will
unintentionally rub some people the wrong way entirely.

Now, the way I see it, is that the established process has fucked up
;). The basic scalar types would not be objectionable in any way two
weeks ago, but we don't have two weeks and nobody ran with a basic RFC
when time was available. We're in the middle of a mad scramble of RFCs
rushing to a vote. The real elephant in the room for many will be why
the PHP7 wasn't just extended once it became obvious that a last
minute rush was inevitable, including an insanely controversial set of
them. Hindsight is always great and perfectly useless to the present
time, and it's all kinds of frustrating. I understand your
perseverance, but we seem stuck with this situation and it won't look
any prettier tomorrow either. Whatever the outcome, PHP 7's process
will be talked about for a very long time.

Paddy

--
P=C3=A1draic Brady

http://blog.astrumfutura.com
http://www.survivethedeepend.com