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To: ajf@ajf.me, andi@zend.com
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Message-ID: <20150205234432.933F5261BE9@dd15934.kasserver.com>
Date: Fri,  6 Feb 2015 00:44:32 +0100 (CET)
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [VOTE] Scalar Type Hints
From: mails@thomasbley.de ("Thomas Bley")

I think the consensus is not so far away.
As far as I understand the rules, it is possible to vote yes and put up a new RFC to remove strict-declare after the voting ends?

Regards
Thomas

Andi Gutmans wrote on 06.02.2015 00:22:

> I have to say I’m pretty disappointed at the opening of the vote. 
> We had a pretty good RFC (thank you) for weak type hinting which was aligned
> with the spirit of PHP and everyone was able to rally around it.
> This has now been morphed into something very hard to swallow and IMO having
> such a declare(…) syntax will be ridiculed by the broader app dev community
> until the end of time… But even that syntax aside (it’s only syntax after
> all), I think we lost the ability to reach consensus on something so important
> to everyone which we haven’t been able to come to agreement on for over 10
> years. Finally it was there, in reach and you made a 180 degree turn.
> 
> I think it’d be so much easier for us to implement weak type hinting. Have
> everyone rally around it. Be happy and then learn and see whether an additional
> mechanism is really necessary. We could even add an E_STRICT_TYPES
> error_reporting flag to help folks “debug” their code if they so wish to
> see if there are any hotspots in their code they may want to take a look at -
> again not necessarily an error but maybe a debugging tool.
> 
> But net, net - why not just implement the thing everyone can agree on. Have
> something really good in the spirit of the PHP Language for PHP 7 and learn how
> people leverage that… The reality is that for the majority of the Web
> community “1” coming in from HTTP should be accepted as a 1. Period.
> 
> I voted “no” but I will vote “yes” for the competing RFC which is 80%
> of your RFC. Why are we not given that option??????
> 
> Andi
> 
> 
>> On Feb 5, 2015, at 12:14 PM, Andrea Faulds <ajf@ajf.me> wrote:
>> 
>> Good evening,
>> 
>> At long last, I’m going to put the RFC to a vote. It’s been long enough -
>> I don’t think there needs to be, or will be, much further discussion.
>> 
>> I’d like to make sure that everyone voting understands the RFC fully. Please
>> read the RFC in full: the details are important. And if  anyone has any
>> questions or uncertainties, please ask them before voting. I am very happy to
>> answer them.
>> 
>> I would urge everyone who wants type hints to vote for this RFC. It is not a
>> perfect solution, but there can be no perfect solution to this issue. However,
>> I think it is better than most of the alternatives suggested thus far - see
>> the rationale section, and previous discussions. Crucially, this RFC would
>> keep PHP a weakly-typed language, and not force either strict typing, nor weak
>> typing, on anyone who does not want it. It would allow the addition of type
>> hints to existing codebases. It would not create a situation where userland
>> functions are strict yet internal functions are not, because the strict mode
>> affects both. I’ve tested the implementation myself on my own code, and it
>> worked well, providing benefits other proposals would not have given (see my
>> previous post about my experiences).
>> 
>> Voting starts today (2015-02-05) and ends in two weeks’ time (2015-02-19).
>> In addition to the vote on the main RFC, there is also a vote on the type
>> aliases issue, and a vote to reserve the type names for future RFCs’ sake if
>> this RFC fails.
>> 
>> The RFC can be found here, and it contains a voting widget:
>> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/scalar_type_hints
>> 
>> Thank you for your time.
>> 
>> --
>> Andrea Faulds
>> http://ajf.me/
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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