Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:77735
Return-Path: <pthreads@pthreads.org>
Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm
Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net
Received: (qmail 45928 invoked from network); 1 Oct 2014 12:59:38 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1)
  by localhost with SMTP; 1 Oct 2014 12:59:38 -0000
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=pthreads@pthreads.org; sender-id=unknown
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=pthreads@pthreads.org; spf=permerror; sender-id=unknown
Received-SPF: error (pb1.pair.com: domain pthreads.org from 209.85.212.182 cause and error)
X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: pthreads@pthreads.org
X-Host-Fingerprint: 209.85.212.182 mail-wi0-f182.google.com  
Received: from [209.85.212.182] ([209.85.212.182:48604] helo=mail-wi0-f182.google.com)
	by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP
	id AB/D0-37933-8BAFB245 for <internals@lists.php.net>; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 08:59:37 -0400
Received: by mail-wi0-f182.google.com with SMTP id n3so516877wiv.3
        for <internals@lists.php.net>; Wed, 01 Oct 2014 05:59:33 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
        h=x-gm-message-state:message-id:subject:from:to:cc:date:in-reply-to
         :references:content-type:mime-version:content-transfer-encoding;
        bh=uoeE6SpWS4Sx52STL3F1Kf9tFZUgDup5f0iSH04aaW4=;
        b=LK5oIFHJmuurNBwOlYPrnGy5l/gx5h7wdQP7FwEKGbwuNMMqZTPzXozZqkG4S9Zzxg
         MsLewDy2qM/86seaEgsnu3R7hBlIsATgZ+6v7tFQnmFsl6g4pHLL0G9dvK04zID83Tp6
         Pu6tdxD/jf1aR3BlalC4x1/eM+vPYnWSMMdDXDiq6w6eBhmoN4M1b+Bz1f1tYWxN16N6
         AGLx3Gv/B6/tjSCVxgZHjpT5PuxFSJikD3aNCHG4ADxQWzMJOwtwPPSICNIJDt+isKMe
         M5QPHyxSwvZ+GtfdIOsduwV2WcZe0NMpiMcSO1la8F1kAD0Sg25z/KmXEt+9cDyxXkmI
         X2Hw==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQnVwq3GNvB2sWYZ879F971fzlnLJY+RWywMwJnEDh6nLeFDxbw4le7HFL0ohvA5nPMnMXnP
X-Received: by 10.180.103.40 with SMTP id ft8mr13925652wib.52.1412168373448;
        Wed, 01 Oct 2014 05:59:33 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.1.67] (host86-136-148-72.range86-136.btcentralplus.com. [86.136.148.72])
        by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id w10sm1126409wje.10.2014.10.01.05.59.32
        for <multiple recipients>
        (version=TLSv1 cipher=RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
        Wed, 01 Oct 2014 05:59:32 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <1412168370.14002.9.camel@localhost.localdomain>
To: Ferenc Kovacs <tyra3l@gmail.com>
Cc: "guilhermeblanco@gmail.com" <guilhermeblanco@gmail.com>, Andrea Faulds
	 <ajf@ajf.me>, Sara Golemon <php@golemon.com>, PHP internals
	 <internals@lists.php.net>
Date: Wed, 01 Oct 2014 13:59:30 +0100
In-Reply-To: <CAH-PCH6vmVOwMQ8EGSK2mVvCZ=XkCzn7iCdTHaToVm_XA_svKA@mail.gmail.com>
References: 
	<CAFp73Xv_bhs5zhA-7Fr4wchiEMCA76a9qMiSQA77CVf9-PnseA@mail.gmail.com>
	 <472D9D28-4AD7-4B98-BBEE-A613F7FCA996@golemon.com>
	 <CAFp73XtNLwpk3z=spnQa6KBJRj3MhA20uGXk03bzxvWgGZJSxA@mail.gmail.com>
	 <004AF0D4-A329-46AB-BFE4-79CDE530BFA4@ajf.me>
	 <CAFp73Xu0rJ1PcRzpdj+_cSguW-oN--=+Zg4gucw47gnZPw1h3g@mail.gmail.com>
	 <CAH-PCH6vmVOwMQ8EGSK2mVvCZ=XkCzn7iCdTHaToVm_XA_svKA@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
X-Mailer: Evolution 3.10.4 (3.10.4-3.fc20) 
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Move pecl_sync to core
From: pthreads@pthreads.org (Joe Watkins)

On Wed, 2014-10-01 at 14:26 +0200, Ferenc Kovacs wrote:
> On Tue, Sep 30, 2014 at 10:18 PM, guilhermeblanco@gmail.com <
> guilhermeblanco@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> > > What does that even mean?
> >
> > It means that any new functionality that gets into core could be considered
> > "young". Like when PHAR got introduced, it was a "young" extension. Same
> > for PDO, same for FileInfo...
> > What I'm trying to highlight is that being a recently coded extension or
> > not, it's not a good argument to say join/no join.
> >
> 
> phar is a really bad example, the maintainers left right after it was
> accepted into the core making it a really bad technical burden, as it
> tightly integrated into the streams handling and stuff, making it a
> liability.
> from the average user POV I think it would be a bit weird why do we add a
> relatively new package which is at the bottom of the download stats (
> http://pecl.php.net/package-stats.php) while not bundling stuff like
> memcache or mongo which are both mature and used/required by much more
> people/project.
> personally I think that a pecl extension needs to have stronger arguments
> to be bundled with php-src than the fact that it would probably create a
> bit more exposure for the ext.
> 

Afternoon,

    I think you got your answer anyway, so this message might fall on
deaf ears.

    The assertion that there is no way to use mutex in a cross platform
way in PHP is actually wrong: http://php.net/mutex

    The number of people that should be using mutex directly in PHP is
about 4. PHP programmers are ill prepared for using such things, making
some code exist, doesn't prepare anyone.

    With a quick glance, there is a number of mistakes in the code.

    There is an incorrect assumption that what this is doing is safe, it
is not.

    You cannot share a mutex across process boundaries without setting
attributes on creation, this includes forked child processes; given
PHP's normal mode of execution does involve forking and
multi-processing, the ideas in this extension are very close to useless.

    If this extension were well written and had all bases covered it
still wouldn't make sense to include it, handing over synchronization to
userland simply will not work.

    So, as you might have guessed, a "-1, and your barking mad" from me.

Cheers
Joe