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Date: Sat, 17 May 2014 18:37:47 +0300
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To: Andrea Faulds <ajf@ajf.me>
Cc: PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] A call for help (urgent)
From: zeev@zend.com (Zeev Suraski)

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On 17 =D7=91=D7=9E=D7=90=D7=99 2014, at 17:32, Andrea Faulds <ajf@ajf.me> w=
rote:


Everyone, please vote yes. The No side is unlikely to lose, due to the 2/3
majority required. The Yes side does need a lot of help to win, though.
Remember, every no vote requires 2 yes votes to counteract it.


That has nothing to do with the fact applying this patch is morally wrong,
and also may or may not be true.


It negates months of hard work performed behind closed doors in secret
(phpng), compared to lots of hard work done in the open (64-bit patch).


Unlike phpng, this is a tactical patch that while changes a lot of code, is
mostly about "dirty work" than research.

Have you used PHP 3?  Then maybe 4?  Surely 5?

All were developed in exactly the same way.  First a working PoC was
established, after lots of trial and error and hard work it was shared with
everyone to join in.

Spinning phpng's work as something evil is as ridiculous as it is wrong.
 Sabotaging it because of it is even worse.

No way. Let=E2=80=99s use the right types for the job. =E2=80=98int=E2=80=
=99 and =E2=80=98long=E2=80=99 should
never be used for sizes of data structures.


This is ridiculous.  But I'm sure you know a lot better than Andi, Derick,
Dmitry, Nikita, Rasmus, Stas, Xinchen and myself.  I fail to understand who
in his rift mins thinks it's both technically and morally legitimate to
force this patch on this group.

It=E2=80=99s not as if 64-bit will kill phpng, it=E2=80=99ll just delay it.


You don't seem to realize what's going on here.  It won't delay it, it'll
greatly slow it down, and given phpng is all about performance - it negates
its goals.  Phpng's key performance gain had to do with compacting it's
data structures.  This goes in the opposite direction, 180 degrees.
 There's no way to fix it later as some suggest, it's an inherent
incompatibility in directions.

For the current PHP it yields an 8% memory increase.  For phpng it'll be a
lot more since it's data structures are more compact and therefore it'll be
a lot more, relatively speaking.

Zeev

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