Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:72778
Return-Path: <rasmus@lerdorf.com>
Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm
Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net
Received: (qmail 10784 invoked from network); 23 Feb 2014 23:01:17 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1)
  by localhost with SMTP; 23 Feb 2014 23:01:17 -0000
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=rasmus@lerdorf.com; sender-id=unknown
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=rasmus@lerdorf.com; spf=permerror; sender-id=unknown
Received-SPF: error (pb1.pair.com: domain lerdorf.com from 209.85.220.46 cause and error)
X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: rasmus@lerdorf.com
X-Host-Fingerprint: 209.85.220.46 mail-pa0-f46.google.com  
Received: from [209.85.220.46] ([209.85.220.46:40507] helo=mail-pa0-f46.google.com)
	by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP
	id F8/46-57053-DBD7A035 for <internals@lists.php.net>; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 18:01:17 -0500
Received: by mail-pa0-f46.google.com with SMTP id rd3so5768592pab.33
        for <internals@lists.php.net>; Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:01:14 -0800 (PST)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=1e100.net; s=20130820;
        h=x-gm-message-state:content-type:mime-version:subject:from
         :in-reply-to:date:cc:content-transfer-encoding:message-id:references
         :to;
        bh=5w4XVxIQ710tzx7VGTrVvGT0QJM4z9oxStDzWSA+Jmk=;
        b=hfHM9GUaFtKSoWgEWjg0hLK4Z6DzX/vNfCGrFm41ikN4RECN9TyOvR44O70PO9pyaD
         +1OprLTxkorVmeJHs4CgzguGIiFHgzhYPHRC1LHDIJjVzeCnKEdt0lMJaSE6NMMGYTNL
         0425yKMDu/YLsE5ApN/hOTesu2sg7b9vgLISh7i6Vhs0iAZoOAa1D2z4RU2y1kAuvwtR
         UtnEpOOIKALxaY4evorXwOQo70xXhoxcIikSXPySQcQzV666o+VeK5XgQ7gL2MWTuA5H
         pPT5NPTrXWRM2iqtrw+g26pcAvZwkqzfoc9g+gHsvGThRgfgnd8jQxeRZ522Vp2rW8nN
         SgfQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQmgCFEII7FK5cMCIpSy1RxAl5GmcD+Z4ljxSb/VauVnf+rVPuf7+Gc1Z4p3N+GseHnJdQza
X-Received: by 10.66.119.136 with SMTP id ku8mr21284899pab.121.1393196474505;
        Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:01:14 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.200.49] (c-50-131-44-225.hsd1.ca.comcast.net. [50.131.44.225])
        by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id sy10sm104851817pac.15.2014.02.23.15.01.13
        for <multiple recipients>
        (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
        Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:01:13 -0800 (PST)
Content-Type: text/plain;
	charset=us-ascii
Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0)
X-Mailer: iPad Mail (11B651)
In-Reply-To: <C020482C-6A5B-4A02-8196-F98AB117C35E@ajf.me>
Date: Sun, 23 Feb 2014 15:01:10 -0800
Cc: Stas Malyshev <smalyshev@sugarcrm.com>,
 Nikita Popov <nikita.ppv@gmail.com>,
 =?utf-8?Q?Rouven_We=C3=9Fling?= <me@rouvenwessling.de>,
 PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Message-ID: <70365961-62C1-47C1-90FB-F97686E579AD@lerdorf.com>
References: <BE8DBAE8-8B03-4834-8553-90DB69B0CD54@rouvenwessling.de> <CAF+90c-9Zva1TJySnGrs6ue0iBX=dXdmWEh+VzWVb71zy+6R9g@mail.gmail.com> <530A5899.1050203@sugarcrm.com> <C020482C-6A5B-4A02-8196-F98AB117C35E@ajf.me>
To: Andrea Faulds <ajf@ajf.me>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [PHP6] Merging rand and mt_rand()
From: rasmus@lerdorf.com (Rasmus Lerdorf)

On Feb 23, 2014, at 13:53, Andrea Faulds <ajf@ajf.me> wrote:
>=20
>=20
>> On 23 Feb 2014, at 20:22, Stas Malyshev <smalyshev@sugarcrm.com> wrote:
>> I would say anybody who relies on RNG producing preset numbers is asking
>> for trouble. If you need mock RNG, mock it out, don't rely on
>> undocumented properties of the system one.
>> But then again, refactoring and unifying RNGs is not very urgent thing
>> and a good candidate to put in a major version.
>=20
>=20
> What? PRNGs guarantee that for a given seed they will always produce the s=
ame sequence. All sorts of things do and should rely on this.

Yup, there is a lot of code out there that relies on this. Plenty of games r=
ely on this for replays or world generation. Just look at Minecraft world se=
eds, for example.

-Rasmus=