Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:72526 Return-Path: Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 69054 invoked from network); 12 Feb 2014 21:22:51 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 12 Feb 2014 21:22:51 -0000 Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=rowan.collins@gmail.com; spf=pass; sender-id=pass Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=rowan.collins@gmail.com; sender-id=pass Received-SPF: pass (pb1.pair.com: domain gmail.com designates 74.125.82.179 as permitted sender) X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: rowan.collins@gmail.com X-Host-Fingerprint: 74.125.82.179 mail-we0-f179.google.com Received: from [74.125.82.179] ([74.125.82.179:65218] helo=mail-we0-f179.google.com) by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP id F7/C8-19387-B26EBF25 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2014 16:22:51 -0500 Received: by mail-we0-f179.google.com with SMTP id q58so6505451wes.38 for ; Wed, 12 Feb 2014 13:22:48 -0800 (PST) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:subject:references :in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding; bh=iy20Fzith3wBp+GTdAWv0sEtAavlIXyIvogJTkT+Tzg=; b=XH+GJQWPl77GqWt1s7kETVbHAtYlbOREIPZVBEDx9nhYe5dpR4gBeXl/Wbd5C7AwCQ GmvxjAa3rtTQeAnaPgdWJp64uR9GTbDTs5eJSXMpkWe+cRNkFYhr1z4SkxhJvniJN+Tm FHiXkXtwd3OvHUK8XxlgiJw6ERz3HAAu0q2d4d20kPPg8AFLtx6UvqcmesjGVSy5sdPf 9xB3THYnBBgls45K71u9X1hLLlpRbmiM7Wz7oIARU3jgXX8wf0qzIg4uPWi4A+rj8kng xjGjzbRkUqnzUHS4a/EBKRkJ5oI4fM0S3hQgb40FA7kdWbrNDiR68ZOscj0sHdjbGOPN CeGw== X-Received: by 10.180.73.141 with SMTP id l13mr3732995wiv.60.1392240168398; Wed, 12 Feb 2014 13:22:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from [192.168.0.152] ([62.189.198.114]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id fb8sm8729200wic.3.2014.02.12.13.22.46 for (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 12 Feb 2014 13:22:47 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <52FBE625.50305@gmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Feb 2014 21:22:45 +0000 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 To: internals@lists.php.net References: <52F00437.7010903@googlemail.com> <52FA71FE.8060808@googlemail.com> <1392151967.3990.11.camel@guybrush> <52FA90B3.5040205@googlemail.com> In-Reply-To: <52FA90B3.5040205@googlemail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] [VOTE] __debugInfo() From: rowan.collins@gmail.com (Rowan Collins) Crypto Compress wrote (on 11/02/2014): >> You can still see "the truth" via reflection and by using a proper >> debugger (like xdebug, I assume) >> > > Reflection is mentioned in RFC. Sadly it does not solve the problem. > Replaced output is *not* bypassable without external tools > (xdebug/phpdbg). If i'am wrong correct me. > The presence of Reflection methods for telling the truth means that a tool can be built entirely in userland (as long as Reflection ext is enabled), which is a lot less "external" than something like xdebug/phpdbg. Regards, -- Rowan Collins [IMSoP]