Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:72471
Return-Path: <cryptocompress@googlemail.com>
Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm
Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net
Received: (qmail 17546 invoked from network); 11 Feb 2014 20:23:55 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1)
  by localhost with SMTP; 11 Feb 2014 20:23:55 -0000
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com smtp.mail=cryptocompress@googlemail.com; spf=pass; sender-id=pass
Authentication-Results: pb1.pair.com header.from=cryptocompress@googlemail.com; sender-id=pass
Received-SPF: pass (pb1.pair.com: domain googlemail.com designates 209.85.212.175 as permitted sender)
X-PHP-List-Original-Sender: cryptocompress@googlemail.com
X-Host-Fingerprint: 209.85.212.175 mail-wi0-f175.google.com  
Received: from [209.85.212.175] ([209.85.212.175:41455] helo=mail-wi0-f175.google.com)
	by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.1.1.9-wez r(12769M)) with ESMTP
	id A0/8B-62230-9D68AF25 for <internals@lists.php.net>; Tue, 11 Feb 2014 15:23:54 -0500
Received: by mail-wi0-f175.google.com with SMTP id hm4so5277830wib.2
        for <internals@lists.php.net>; Tue, 11 Feb 2014 12:23:50 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=googlemail.com; s=20120113;
        h=message-id:date:from:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc:subject
         :references:in-reply-to:content-type:content-transfer-encoding;
        bh=tmtBCDgjZ8q7N829wnI6Wq/jYghDxWg3YaGXvd6m1VA=;
        b=TRY2WDjt2xL3LBiP7dODrkXgR3++23ObGIwPTPzcCdFS9ens0rfgLT9Rvmx8Rgq9AF
         B5Wk6nbMvWDFlCk2aoqvl4TouiNzXJTMyuh8BPe8WHn9ifsCbsqhNlel7sZRgTjKekeZ
         cxXmFQS1XtZaMOnra5uj3biemPgdvpQUD3xj90WHVoPifyM2P1S3/6ORlzf0Sbe8X8r2
         TKi7VpLm99C/AJxpwGdVNqwrPvwWmUfKsvu+Ofgh3y1a3Kz7yyTpwvJHvjJU9W3+HOVh
         vX2KbNI+Qd74I/1T5nUxo57I4lJ/zKeor5aageG+9mPDKmDTTX58obqpe496x5hDBF9t
         z4dA==
X-Received: by 10.194.185.237 with SMTP id ff13mr28464wjc.64.1392150228914;
        Tue, 11 Feb 2014 12:23:48 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.1.115] (mnch-5d8774be.pool.mediaWays.net. [93.135.116.190])
        by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id ev4sm395300wib.1.2014.02.11.12.23.46
        for <multiple recipients>
        (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128);
        Tue, 11 Feb 2014 12:23:47 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <52FA86C1.8000106@googlemail.com>
Date: Tue, 11 Feb 2014 21:23:29 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:24.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/24.3.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Rowan Collins <rowan.collins@gmail.com>
CC: PHP Developers Mailing List <internals@lists.php.net>
References: <CAESVnVq3PB+OFXGR+yJ1L2BuX_4+pHyjjvJ8rZXnxexXozyT4A@mail.gmail.com>	<CAGfRu7Ot_sNhvQY1b18Wb-7UB3uihXsSXPVb=cHhEhA0s4ijVQ@mail.gmail.com>	<52F00437.7010903@googlemail.com>	<CAGa2bXanS9VY0j8JQ4oGkEFHmbof-gDmBtpHDMuhMK_K0CEMJg@mail.gmail.com>	<52F005E6.6090702@googlemail.com>	<CAGa2bXa-BHmwbyqBQJgoNqoy=CLppJ8GYp2__GGdkpk6UttuMQ@mail.gmail.com>	<CAGa2bXboT_7rVX7c02hmtYtdjF=_FtX-P7aRT5JFvjEb22JJYg@mail.gmail.com>	<CAESVnVrRsByJ00xU+R35aSH8KF6Xa14O2_weTUGEY5t20+HTtg@mail.gmail.com>	<52F0D36B.7010905@googlemail.com>	<CAESVnVrrhveh1p2afcd4ov+jry6wnZB=NkEO_Nxq6B7pj0=_Tg@mail.gmail.com>	<52F29880.6050304@googlemail.com>	<CAESVnVppgdTS8DaSOb6Y4Y-34RDHYiR=xnCZpKNNCb4SDzrHLQ@mail.gmail.com>	<52F29B04.9080609@googlemail.com> <CAESVnVqvy8uSd=x-Lwp0juVCo9+2SSgamkehOzMbx555GVZePg@mail.gmail.com> <52F9D766.1090902@googlemail.com> <52FA6C08.5050207@googlemail.com> <52FA82DD.9030909@gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <52FA82DD.9030909@gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] [VOTE] __debugInfo()
From: cryptocompress@googlemail.com (Crypto Compress)

Am 11.02.2014 21:06, schrieb Rowan Collins:
> On 11/02/2014 18:29, Crypto Compress wrote:
>> Imagine a proxy object (orm).
>>
>> Usecase #1: end-user
>> Sees only proxied object. No cluttered object graph. Very useful!
>>
>> Usecase #2: new maintainer
>> Hunting bug in proxy object. No way to dump internals at all. Wait what?
>>
>
> On the other hand, usecase #3: hunting bug in incredibly complex 
> object and "can't see the wood for the trees" because object graph 
> fills pages of output.
>
> Temporarily (re-)implement __debugInfo() to output a few relevant 
> properties, and all becomes much clearer. I could have used this 
> earlier today, in fact; I ended up with something like dump( 
> array($this->foo, $this->bar, $this->baz) )

Yes! I'm convinced this hook is a very useful extension for poor man's 
debugger.
Would like to see status quo enhanced, not replaced.


>
> There might be merit in a way of viewing the "real" contents of an 
> object, I guess, although that doesn't have any meaning for objects 
> exposed by extensions anyway, as they can overload in ways user-land 
> can only dream of. (Hence SimpleXML being so confusing if you try to 
> debug it as though it were a "real" object.)
>

Yes again! Got headache thinking of userland devs get this power without 
a way to bypass it.