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Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2013 21:13:09 +0200
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] New feature: sequential constructors
From: lang@b1-systems.de (Ralf Lang)

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On 03.07.2013 20:48, Sanford Whiteman wrote:
>> Most often if I need a super __construct(), I don't need it exactly
>> before or exactly after the bottom constructor but at a specific point=

>> where I can setup super's input data and do stuff to its output.
>=20
> I've most often seen, or reluctantly implemented, the Call Super
> antipattern by putting the call at the bottom of sub code.
>=20
> It's true that it's an antipattern regardless of "advisory" placement.
> But to me, somewhere-in-the-middle is even smellier than usual, since
> in human hands that's got to be more prone to failure.
>=20
> I think if Contractual Call Super were considered for the language it
> should have before and after variants, not just after. There isn't a
> practical way to declare "at some point," is there, even if you wanted
> it?

No, that's why I am asking. Why is it an anti-pattern to call a known
super constructor? Not knowing the implementation details, I still know
the documented api (which is all a class should ask for).

>> What is the typical use case for calling all supers (before or after t=
he
>> class' __construct itself) ?
>=20
> I can't think of a valid case in my memory for _all_ supers. Typically
> you mean to call the immediate super _or_ the root super. Which is of
> course the problem with the "advisory" form of this pattern, since
> innocently inserting an intermediate class breaks your code.

This makes it more complicated. Do you mean next super or root super (or
root-1 as any class object is an "object" ?
I don't mean to disrupt any ideas. I just think how I would use or
expect to use the feature.


> If this feature were introduced, I see no reason for it to be allowed
> to call more than one method for each occurrence of 'sequential'
> keyword.
>=20
> That is,
>=20
> class A { sequentialBefore function __construct() {} }
> class Asub extends A { function __construct() {} }
> class Asubsub extends Asub { function __construct() {} }
>=20
> would run A::__construct and then Asubsub::construct()
>=20
> class A { sequentialBefore function __construct() {} }
> class Asub extends A { sequentialBefore function __construct() {} }
> class Asubsub extends Asub { function __construct() {} }
>=20
> would run A::__construct, Asub::__construct, Asubsub::__construct
>=20
> class A { sequentialBefore function __construct() {} }
> class Asub extends A { sequentialAfter function __construct() {} }
> class Asubsub extends Asub { function __construct() {} }
>=20
> would run A::__construct, Asubsub::construct(), Asub::__construct

> I'm not particularly cheering for this feature but enjoy thinking
> about how it might work. If you see my notes on the previous thread
> you can see I'm pretty adamant about Call Super being very bad
> _unless_ it's baked into the language in an interesting way.

Not that it would be an argument but just for understanding: Do you know
any scripting language which has this? This would help me seeing the
idea as I know some of them.	=09


--=20
Ralf Lang
Linux Consultant / Developer
Mail: lang@b1-systems.de
B1 Systems GmbH
Osterfeldstra=C3=9Fe 7 / 85088 Vohburg / http://www.b1-systems.de
GF: Ralph Dehner / Unternehmenssitz: Vohburg / AG: Ingolstadt,HRB 3537


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