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To: "Pierre Joye" <pierre.php@gmail.com>, "Stas Malyshev"
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Cc: "PHP Internals" <internals@lists.php.net>
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Date: Sun, 02 Sep 2012 01:51:49 +0200
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: Are exceptions allowed in php core?
From: glopes@nebm.ist.utl.pt ("Gustavo Lopes")

On Sun, 02 Sep 2012 01:04:10 +0200, Stas Malyshev <smalyshev@sugarcrm.com>  
wrote:

>>> SPL is not a part of basic language syntax. There are no SPL keywords
>>> and no SPL classes used unless you explicitly instantiate those  
>>> classes.
>>> So SPL is different.
>>
>> End users do not see nor buy the difference between what is Zend/ or
>> what is ext/spl (or other) and can't be disabled, like SPL.
>
> Of course they'd see it. Here it goes again: "There are no SPL keywords
>  and no SPL classes used unless you explicitly instantiate those
> classes". You can not just write some plain PHP syntax and end up having
> SPL class. If you use SPL class, you must do "new SplSomeClass" or
> something similar. It has nothing to do with disabling.

This is thoroughly unconvincing. Let me see if I got this:

Users do not expect exceptions in the core. They distinguish the core from  
the rest because the core is what they interact it when they "use only PHP  
syntax" (itself an odd statement, but let's let it pass).

This argument has at least these shortcomings:

* If users do not expect exceptions in the core, they are mistaken. There  
are indeed exceptions in the core. See ZEND_FE_RESET and  
zend_interfaces.c. Of course, no evidence has been provided one way or  
another.

* Most ext/spl classes are not prefixed. If you ask the average PHP  
developer to tell between Iterator, IteratorAggregate, RecursiveIterator,  
ArrayAccess and Serializable, which are core and which are ext/spl, I  
doubt many would get the answer right. Not that they should care.

* In fact, if there is a unifying theme in the usage of exceptions in PHP,  
is that exceptions are used when OOP interfaces are involved (see Zend  
interfaces, SPL, DateTime and PDO -- though optional there). The core vs.  
non-core argument only looks attractive because there are few built-in  
classes in the core.

To be sure, there's one important distinction between core and ext/spl.  
ext/spl should depend on core, not the other way around. Which has little  
relevance for this discussion.

-- 
Gustavo Lopes