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Date: Thu, 19 Jul 2012 12:45:54 +0100
Message-ID: <CAN+gjSco0X0eyM=vrd3W7fQWcp+rVtvmDPFZ2Rj48B+6n=mrwA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Rasmus Lerdorf <rasmus@lerdorf.com>
Cc: Pierre Joye <pierre.php@gmail.com>, Stas Malyshev <smalyshev@sugarcrm.com>, 
	David Muir <davidkmuir@gmail.com>, internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary=f46d043c7d14809ede04c52d5219
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Pseudo-objects (methods on arrays, strings, etc.)
From: ajfweb@googlemail.com (Andrew Faulds)

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Right, because I've never got them the wrong way round, that is completely
logical, and this syntax makes it much harder.
On Jul 19, 2012 1:17 AM, "Rasmus Lerdorf" <rasmus@lerdorf.com> wrote:

> On 07/18/2012 05:10 PM, David Muir wrote:
> > On 19/07/12 04:49, Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:
> >> On 07/18/2012 01:02 AM, Pierre Joye wrote:
> >>> hi,
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 9:35 AM, Stas Malyshev
> >>> <smalyshev@sugarcrm.com> wrote:
> >>>> Hi!
> >>>>
> >>>>> See the other answers, clear APIs, no more argument mess, cleanness.
> >>>> Cleanness has nothing to do with pseudo-objects.You don't have to use
> >>>> -> to have clean APIs, and using -> doesn't automatically make your
> >>>> APIs
> >>>> clean.
> >>> I really do not want to have a semantic discussion here.
> >>>
> >>> This syntax is sexy, allows us to clean our APIs, and is amazingly
> >>> handy.
> >> This makes no sense to me either. How does it let us clean the APIs? Can
> >> you give an example? I have one:
> >>
> >> $a = -5;
> >> $b = "-5";
> >>
> >> echo $a->abs();  // Outputs 5
> >> echo $b->abs();  // should still output 5
> >>
> >> What has been cleaned here over:
> >>
> >> echo abs($a);
> >> echo abs($b);
> >>
> >> other than being 2 characters longer to type? It's not like you can
> >> remove abs() from the string pseudo-object, so you are essentially just
> >> taking all the functions in the global namespace and attaching them as a
> >> method to every pseudo-object. Is that clean?
> >>
> >> I think there is something we can do around this, but an argument of "it
> >> is sexy and clean" needs to be backed up with some actual implementation
> >> details that make sense.
> >>
> >> -Rasmus
> >>
> >
> > Which is the needle, and which is the haystack?
> > $pos = strpos($string, 'a');
> > $pos = strpos('a', $string);
> >
> > vs
> > $pos = $string->pos('a');
> > $pos = 'a'->pos($string);
> >
> > I'm not proposing to use pos() as the method name, just showing an
> > example that this syntax can be cleaner.
>
> Or you could simply remember that it is always haystack,needle for
> strings and needle,haystack for arrays. Not that complicated.
>
> -Rasmus
>
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