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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [patch] error masks
From: stas@zend.com (Stanislav Malyshev)

Hi!

> Because it may force to fix the errors, rather then ignore them?

Come on. That doesn't make any sense. If people deliberately disabled 
the error, they don't want to see it, and they will not see it. Making 
it slow doesn't do anything useful. Let's insert some sleep()'s into 
zend_error() too, would it make it better? Let's make E_DEPRECATED take 
5 seconds, that'll show them.
Making engine work slow to force people into some behavior is very 
misguided idea. I can't believe it is proposed to make invisible 
slowdowns in unknown places as a means to make people write better code.

> There is very little modern code that is @ ridden like the stuff written 

If we discard emotional terms like "ridden" - there is such code in 
almost every major app out there. Just search for @fopen or @include or 
@xml or @eval - tons of examples. Ans the reason is simple - people do 
not always want PHP to display/log errors for them. Sometimes they don't 
care for the errors, sometimes they want to handle the error by other 
means.

> before. The way to have the engine not do the work, would be as simple 
> as fixing the code, which is the right solution here.

What you still can't see if that this code is not broken, there's 
nothing to fix - this code is EXPLICITLY saying "do this, and if there's 
a error - ignore it". That's what the author wants. It's not an omission 
or mistake - it's intentional, it's part of the requirements. Only 
error_reporting now is broken so ignored errors waste excessive time. 
The right solution here is to fix error system so ignored errors not 
waste excessive time.

> The production value we use according to php.ini-production is E_ALL & 
> ~E_DEPRECATED, which means E_NOTICE will not be hidden.

Which conveniently ignores my argument about all other error types and 
bigger argument that THERE ARE such types and people ignore them on 
purpose, not because they are stupid.

> Well, if you are going to hide them, the no one will ever debug them, 
> let alone know that they exist.

How one would know they exist if reporting is disabled? By guessing it 
from the slowdown? I can't believe deliberately slowing down user 
applications in unknown places is really being recommended as a way of 
debugging.
The fact is we have error_reporting and @, and however you may hate 
them, they exist and they are used. My patch only makes them do what 
they should be doing from the start, while keeping BC and allowing a bit 
more flexibility in advanced cases where you have special needs (like 
monitoring system that collects unreported errors, etc.).
-- 
Stanislav Malyshev, Zend Software Architect
stas@zend.com   http://www.zend.com/
(408)253-8829   MSN: stas@zend.com