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To: "'Steph Fox'" <steph@php.net>,
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Date: Tue, 14 Oct 2008 20:51:10 +0300
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Disposition-Notification-To: "Catalin Zamfir Alexandru | KIT Software CAZ" <office@kitsoftware.ro>
Subject: RE: [PHP-DEV] namespaces and alpha3
From: office@kitsoftware.ro ("Catalin Zamfir Alexandru | KIT Software CAZ")

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Guys, a recomandation (about namespaces):
	- if it's not tested enough, don't include it in the release.
	- if it's going to make a lot of confusion, don't include it in the
release.
	- if neither of the two above won't stop it being included,
and if there aren't 3 quarters (75%) of developers willing to accept
namespaces,
don't include it in the release.
	- in short, whatever feature that may cause more headaches or
doesn't have
any real support in the developer community should not be packed for a
release.

	Those were my 2 cents ...

Yours,
Catalin Z. Alexandru

----------------------------


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Steph Fox [mailto:steph@php.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 8:47 PM
> To: Stanislav Malyshev; internals@lists.php.net
> Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] namespaces and alpha3
> 
> Hi Stas,
> 
> > The thing is that there's nothing here that would improve with time.
> 
> Except the chance to test approaches that are currently only theories.
> 
> > Pushing in to 6.0 is basically throwing it out forever, since there's
> > nothing we could do in 6.0 that we can't do now, there's nothing that
> we
> > could do "only if we had time", and only thing will happen towards the
> > release of 6.0 is that we will repeat the whole story again.
> 
> Not so, most of it's there, agreed and tested. What there is, is already
> in
> PHP 6.
> 
> I don't see
> > how anything will change in 6.0 from now except that it will happen in
> 2-3
> > years,
> 
> I would _hope_ it would happen from the moment 5.3 is out of the door,
> not
> at the last moment before the 6.0 release!
> 
> > so in the meantime PHP would miss a feature much needed, much
> advertised
> > and much supported by the user base.
> > We are at the point we just need to take decision. I understand the
> > natural tendency of people to avoid taking complicated decisions by
> > postponing the problem, but if you are not ready to take the
> > responsibility, please do not try to put is as any kind of decision.
> 
> This was one of the four options we were given. Just because you don't
> like
> it, doesn't mean there are now only three.
> 
> > It is not. If you don't know what to do with it, if you don't
> understand
> > the feature, if you don't feel comfortable with deciding how it should
> > be - don't say "let's throw it off", it is not a constructive
> approach.
> > There's nothing that will change from now to 6.0 except that the
> people
> > who worked a lot on this feature would be less ready to repeat the
> ordeal.
> 
> This is very negative, Stas. "Everybody wants it so let's push it out
> without testing". Do you really want a repeat of 5.0?
> 
> > So please do not allow inability to take decision and unwillingness to
> > address the problem to deprive PHP users of much needed functionality.
> 
> Please don't go emotional on us :)
> 
> - Steph
> 
> 
> --
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