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Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2008 11:22:52 +0100
To: "sean finney" <seanius@debian.org>
Cc: internals@lists.php.net, "Ilia Alshanetsky" <ilia@prohost.org>, 
	"Joe Orton" <jorton@redhat.com>, "Derick Rethans" <derick@php.net>
In-Reply-To: <200801100511.30704.seanius@debian.org>
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References: <20080109141541.GA14571@redhat.com>
	 <3B0880D2-C5C4-45C6-ABD4-C6B8316E1498@prohost.org>
	 <200801100511.30704.seanius@debian.org>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [PATCH] date/timelib: use system timezone database
From: pierre.php@gmail.com (Pierre)

Hi Sean,

On Jan 10, 2008 5:10 AM, sean finney <seanius@debian.org> wrote:
> Hi Ilia, Joe,
>
> On Wednesday 09 January 2008 08:50:59 pm Ilia Alshanetsky wrote:
> > The reason we do not use the system database is because it is
> > inconsistent and likely is updated less frequently then the one
> > included with PHP.
> >
> > -1.
>
> Personally I think this patch would be great, and I will recommend it to the
> other debian php maintainers for review.  It would certainly be a lot better
> than our current solution, where the timezone db has been ripped out of php
> and put into a seperate package which is managed outside of the stable
> release cycle (in the "volatile" release area).
>
> I understand that it may make the job of developing/releasing/supporting
> easier for you to bundle the timezone db (just like libgd, et c), but please
> consider the position of those who are responsible for maintaining not just
> your software but thousands of other projects' packages...  wouldn't it be
> possible to at least make this some kind of compile-time option for those of
> us who do like the idea?

Besides the issues listed by Derick, there is two problems with these
choices (distro making design changes to upstream software). First it
creates an uncontrollable gray area where you have to be lucky if your
software works out of the box on a given distribution. PHP (and GD in
particular) is a pain on Debian (btw, is the pollitics about libgd in
debian finally gone? :( ). Please don't add the timezone to the list
of troubles.

The 2nd problem are the ISPs and other sys admins. They keep outdated
or customized systems on their systems. If distros start to use the
system timezone, I'm sure we will see very old databases on many
servers in a couple of years. That's an upcoming bomb. It is not
directly the distributions fault, but this problem is particullary
true for Debian users (IPS using debian). Debian being conservative,
their users are even more conservative and reluctant to update their
systems. The worst is that they even follow blindly your choices.


Cheers,
-- 
Pierre
http://blog.thepimp.net | http://www.libgd.org