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Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 14:53:51 -0400
To: "Rasmus Lerdorf" <rasmus@lerdorf.com>
Cc: "Bart de Boer" <bart@mediawave.nl>, "Tijnema !" <tijnema@gmail.com>, 
	"Guilherme Blanco" <guilhermeblanco@gmail.com>, ceo@l-i-e.com, 
	"Chad Daelhousen" <chad@herballure.com>, 
	"Ron Korving" <r.korving@xit.nl>, internals@lists.php.net
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] dropping asp_tags in HEAD
From: nicobn@gmail.com ("=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nicolas_A._B=E9rard-Nault?=")

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I think Rasmus summarized pretty well the essence of the initial decision
that was made to include short tags. After getting all these precisions, I'=
m
more inclined to the statut quo side, not that my opinion really matters,
but I just feel there is no consensus right now and that this discussion
runs into an obvious dead-end. What are we gaining by removing short tags ?
Obviously nothing. What are we losing ? A lot of people demonstrated the
usefulness, may it be limited, of the asp/short tags hence I feel we will
lose something.

Purity in itself may be an argument, but not in a language that deems itsel=
f
pragmatic.

My 2 cents.


On 4/14/07, Rasmus Lerdorf <rasmus@lerdorf.com> wrote:
>
> Bart de Boer wrote:
> > I feel I can't disagree with my hero. :) But is that really so?
> >
> > The XML spec says:
> >
> > PI ::=3D '<?' PITarget (S (Char* - (Char* '?>' Char*)))? '?>'
> >
> > Doesn't Char* mean any char?
> >
> > All the parsers seem to accept '>' inside PI's without problems too.
>
> If you pick your standards carefully, sure.  ;)
>
> I chose the PHP syntax before there was an XML spec.  Back in the dark
> ages where HTML was defined as an SGML DTD.  In SGML-speak <? is a
> general delimiter called PIO, < is STAGO and > is PIC.  In those early
> HTML DTD's you couldn't have a PIO element that contained STAGO or PIC.
> ISO-8879 has all the uglyness in it if you want to dig a bit, but even
> with that it doesn't really tell the whole story of the conditions at
> the time.
>
> The point being that it was a conscious decision to not try to strictly
> comply with the specification at the time or to write a PHP DTD, but
> instead to focus on convenience first and the spec second.  You still
> have plenty of things you can do today that doesn't match modern XML
> specs.  For example:
>
> <?php echo '?>'; ?>
>
> Or anything with ctrl chars in it.  You can put a literal 0x07 char in a
> quoted string, for example, and PHP will happily pass that through, but
> that is also not allowed in the spec.
>
> -Rasmus
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
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>
>
--=20
Nicolas B=E9rard-Nault (nicobn@gmail.com)
=C9tudiant D.E.C. Sciences, Lettres & Arts
C=E9gep de Sherbrooke

Page personnelle: http://nicobn.googlepages.com

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