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Date: Sat, 14 Apr 2007 12:51:12 -0400
To: "Bart de Boer" <bart@mediawave.nl>
Cc: "Rasmus Lerdorf" <rasmus@lerdorf.com>, "Tijnema !" <tijnema@gmail.com>, 
	"Guilherme Blanco" <guilhermeblanco@gmail.com>, ceo@l-i-e.com, 
	"Chad Daelhousen" <chad@herballure.com>, 
	"Ron Korving" <r.korving@xit.nl>, internals@lists.php.net
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] dropping asp_tags in HEAD
From: nicobn@gmail.com ("=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Nicolas_A._B=E9rard-Nault?=")

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Maybe I'm missing something here, but why should PHP be compliant with a
standard that absolutely has nothing to do with the language (c.f.: XML) ?
Isn't it obvious that a file with the extension .php is NOT an XML file ? I=
t
seems to me the short tags issue is starting to become a bikeshed
argument...

Again, sorry if I'm missing the point.


On 4/14/07, Bart de Boer <bart@mediawave.nl> wrote:
>
> I feel I can't disagree with my hero. :) But is that really so?
>
> The XML spec says:
>
> PI ::=3D '<?' PITarget (S (Char* - (Char* '?>' Char*)))? '?>'
>
> Doesn't Char* mean any char?
>
> All the parsers seem to accept '>' inside PI's without problems too.
>
> Furthermore... PHP may not be the most beautiful of languages... But
> that doesn't mean it has to be ugly...
>
>
> -Bart
>
>
> Rasmus Lerdorf wrote:
> > PHP was never meant to win any beauty contests, nor to enforce
> > standards.  If you want to take your argument to its logical conclusion
> > then you have to also take the next step and not allow literal entities
> > inside the PHP blocks, because that is also not standards compliant.
> > That means you cannot write:
> >
> >   <?php if($a > 10) foo() ?>
> >
> > You would have to change it to:
> >
> >   <?php if($a &gt; 10) foo() ?>
> >
> > And that's just a simple example of that.
> >
> > -Rasmus
> >
> > Bart de Boer wrote:
> >
> >> And let me stress that this is something we're *forcing* people to do
> >> when they're on a short tags enabled server... It's not something
> >> they're allowed to do at free will... PHP's convention is currently
> >> responsible for people creating non-standards-compliant documents...
> And
> >> I think we should take that responsibility and clean up the mess we
> >> made... The XML spec is outside our scope... What's inside <?php tags
> is
> >> our business...
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Tijnema ! wrote:
> >>
> >>> On 4/14/07, Bart de Boer <bart@mediawave.nl> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I think ASP tags should go too... Simply because it's not standards
> >>>> compliant and I think it's good if people are forced to make nice
> >>>> standards compliant documents... I'd even go so far as to favor
> dropping
> >>>> short tags too...
> >>>>
> >>>> <? echo "<?xml version=3D\"1.0\" encoding=3D\"UTF-8\" ?>\n"; ?>
> >>>>
> >>>> What a mess!...
> >>>>
> >>> What about the even shorter version:
> >>> <?=3D"<?xml version=3D\"1.0\" encoding=3D\"UTF-8\" ?>\n"; ?>
> >>>
> >>> That's real ugly code...
> >>>
> >>> Tijnema
> >>>
> >>>> Guilherme Blanco wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> I really can't see a reason to mantain ASP tags.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Ok, short tags is good because of <?=3D$something?>, but it doesn't
> >>>>> behavior well with XML documents. So, if your intention is to chang=
e
> >>>>> short tags to ASP tag in a near future, ok. ASP tags does not mix
> XML
> >>>>> documents.
> >>>>> Otherwise, ASP tags is the most useless thing I've ever heard in PH=
P
> >>>>> sphere. I really don't know why wasn't it dropped in PHP5.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> That's what I think... IMHO.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> []s,
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 4/13/07, Tijnema ! <tijnema@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> On 4/13/07, Richard Lynch <ceo@l-i-e.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Fri, April 13, 2007 9:16 am, Tijnema ! wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> I don't see why you are all against dropping the ASP tags. I see
> >>>>>>>> people using ASP & PHP in one script, what would that do? If
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>> ASP runs
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>> first then there isn't a problem, but if PHP runs first, it woul=
d
> >>>>>>>> execute the ASP code.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> There are actually people running both PHP and ASP in series to
> >>>>>>> generate HTML?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> If they are, they can turn ASP tags *OFF* in php.ini
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> And they certainly aren't going to be distributing that setup
> >>>>>>>
> >>>> outside
> >>>>
> >>>>>>> their own little world...
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> I've seen such code on the net some time ago...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> But should you distribute PHP code with ASP tags? That's not good
> >>>>>> either i think. So there's no use of the ASP tags, and they can
> only
> >>>>>> interfere with ASP.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Tijnema
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
> >>>>>> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
> To unsubscribe, visit: http://www.php.net/unsub.php
>
>


--=20
Nicolas B=E9rard-Nault (nicobn@gmail.com)
=C9tudiant D.E.C. Sciences, Lettres & Arts
C=E9gep de Sherbrooke

Page personnelle: http://nicobn.googlepages.com

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