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Date: Tue, 16 May 2006 15:08:16 -0700
To: Jason Garber <jason@ionzoft.com>
Cc: Marcus Boerger <helly@php.net>,Zeev Suraski <zeev@zend.com>,
	PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] private, protected, readonly, public
From: andi@zend.com (Andi Gutmans)

Yeah you can take a look at internal functions/classes that operate 
on objects and see whether the readonly semantics might need to work 
in some of those cases.

Thanks for the offer!

At 02:59 PM 5/16/2006, Jason Garber wrote:
>Hello Andi,
>
>   Your request for edge condition research is an excellent one.  We've
>   just been through a hellish couple weeks of QA failures (at my
>   company) which just *underscore* your point.  The last thing any of
>   us needs is a broken PHP.
>
>   That being said, is there anything I can do to help us find this
>   stuff out?
>
>--
>Best regards,
>  Jason                            mailto:jason@ionzoft.com
>
>Tuesday, May 16, 2006, 5:41:31 PM, you wrote:
>
>AG> Where would readable be enforced? Would it try and prevent getting
>AG> references to it? Are there any internal functions/classes which need
>AG> fixing to honor readable?
>
>AG> I think these answers would really be helpful.
>
>AG> Thanks.
>
>AG> Andi
>
>AG> At 02:37 PM 5/16/2006, Marcus Boerger wrote:
> >>Hello Andi,
> >>
> >>   that is why most here already switched to "public readable".
> >>
> >>best regards
> >>marcus
> >>
> >>Tuesday, May 16, 2006, 11:31:14 PM, you wrote:
> >>
> >> > I can't quite explain it but for me the ability to work-around
> >> > private with methods which are able to access the private variable,
> >> > is different than marking a property as read-only but it not being
> >> > read-only in all semantics. Probably because private variables do
> >> > often have getters and setters, whereas something which is marked as
> >> > read-only (like a harddrive) tends to be read-only always.
> >>
> >> > Andi
> >>
> >> > At 02:08 PM 5/16/2006, Zeev Suraski wrote:
> >> >>>However, the reason i write this mail is that you said there could be
> >> >>>problems. Well this is deply integrated  in the handlers and they don't
> >> >>>let you out. In other words if this stuff is not working then the whole
> >> >>>PHP 5+ object model is broken. Or in other words, if this is 
> broken alot
> >> >>>of other stuff regarding object handling is already broken.
> >> >>
> >> >>You're probably right about this one.  You can already return a
> >> >>reference to a private variable today and change it.  Andi - did you
> >> >>mean something else?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>Best regards,
> >>  Marcus