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To: "D. Dante Lorenso" <dante@vocalspace.com>
CC: Jochem Maas <jochem@iamjochem.com>,
	Rick Widmer <vchkpw@developersdesk.com>,
	PHPdev <internals@lists.php.net>
References: <44584619.60400@lorenso.com> <200605030815.34801.johannes@php.net> <44585828.1030603@vocalspace.com> <BCFE5FAA-E5EF-4401-BA0A-F353810FCA0F@aplosmedia.com> <44585E89.6000400@vocalspace.com> <44586BDF.6040600@developersdesk.com> <4459410D.9090802@vocalspace.com> <445942E9.201@developersdesk.com> <44594553.6020009@iamjochem.com> <44594A27.4040201@vocalspace.com>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Seeking 'coalesce' php internal function
From: rasmus@lerdorf.com (Rasmus Lerdorf)

Not sure what you guys are talking about.  ?: is on the roadmap.

-Rasmus

D. Dante Lorenso wrote:
> Jochem Maas wrote:
>> point 1: regardless of how people think there should be an ifsetor()
>> in the engine - the devs don't so there wont be one.
> Arrrrvvhggghh!  Don't you just want to scream!
> 
>> point 2: anything trying to implement this functionality in userspace
>> is a hack. (to stregethen that stance: Rasmus reiterated the point a few
>> days ago [can't remember which mailinglist] that people should be 
>> trying to
>> write *error free* code - ergo the error suppression is not a proper 
>> solution)
> 
> Ok.  You CAN NOT implement 'ifsetor/coalesce/filled' in userspace.  And 
> the devs don't want it to exist ... so, WTF?
>> Dante, live with the hack. :-)
> Translate to: Dante, you don't need PHP to be better, adequate is good 
> enough.
> 
> <soap box>
> Come on devs, I'm pleading with you.  Say it isn't so.  You force me to 
> write so much extra code unless this functionality exists in the core.
> 
> Explain to me how every possible thing you might want to do to an array 
> gets it's own function in the language, but something as trivial as this 
> gets refused so strongly!
> 
> I mean really: array_change_key_case, array_chunk, array_combine, 
> array_count_values, array_diff_assoc, array_diff_key, array_diff_uassoc, 
> ...
>    http://www.php.net/manual/en/ref.array.php
> 
> You can't tell me that most if not all of these functions could not have 
> been implemented in userspace?  I might use 10% of all the array 
> functions, but I'd use 'coalesce' and 'filled' daily.
> </soap box>
> 
> Tell me at least this much.  Can these two functions be implemented as 
> an extension? From what you know about PHP internals, does what WE want 
> have to be a language construct?  If I can write coalesce() and filled() 
> as extensions, I'll submit a new extension/patch.  Maybe it could join 
> PECL and with popularity make it's way begrudgingly into the core?
> 
> Dante
>