Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:20464 Return-Path: Mailing-List: contact internals-help@lists.php.net; run by ezmlm Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 32356 invoked by uid 1010); 26 Nov 2005 00:20:42 -0000 Delivered-To: ezmlm-scan-internals@lists.php.net Delivered-To: ezmlm-internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 32341 invoked from network); 26 Nov 2005 00:20:42 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO lists.php.net) (127.0.0.1) by localhost with SMTP; 26 Nov 2005 00:20:42 -0000 X-Host-Fingerprint: 69.64.38.41 bluga.net Linux 2.5 (sometimes 2.4) (4) Received: from ([69.64.38.41:53337] helo=bluga.net) by pb1.pair.com (ecelerity 2.0 beta r(6323M)) with SMTP id 1A/0D-56276-A5AA7834 for ; Fri, 25 Nov 2005 19:20:42 -0500 Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by bluga.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3919221CF52; Fri, 25 Nov 2005 18:22:15 -0600 (CST) Received: from bluga.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (bluga.net [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 17167-07; Fri, 25 Nov 2005 18:22:14 -0600 (CST) Received: from [192.168.1.101] (ftcl002.digis.net [66.17.140.42]) by bluga.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4279B21CDFF; Fri, 25 Nov 2005 18:22:14 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <4387AA54.70002@php.net> Date: Fri, 25 Nov 2005 18:20:36 -0600 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird 1.0.6 (Windows/20050716) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Marcus Boerger CC: internals@lists.php.net References: <7.0.0.16.2.20051124161240.0573e640@zend.com> <20051125034515.6fefa4e2@localhost.localdomain> <43867C6C.2010209@prohost.org> <20051125040950.26305e08@localhost.localdomain> <43869FC5.4060708@lerdorf.com> <20051125075501.79718ee6@localhost.localdomain> <1132903004.9936.25.camel@localhost.localdomain> <1086017308.20051125091648@marcus-boerger.de> In-Reply-To: <1086017308.20051125091648@marcus-boerger.de> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Virus-Scanned: by amavisd-new using ClamAV at bluga.net Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: PHP 5.1 (Or How to break tousands of apps out there) From: cellog@php.net (Greg Beaver) Marcus Boerger wrote: > Hello Helgi, > > obviously one problem is that PEAR does ignore coding standards. Classes > should be prefixed in both pear and core. And neither Date nor File is in > any way prefixed. In th end all we see here is that we want namespaces asap. I absolutely agree with these points. It is also worth noting that the coding standards of prefixing classes were introduced long after packages like "Date" existed. We have a case of a userbase and a shifting foundation that is PHP. Perhaps the best future of PEAR is to design with those shifting sands in mind as more of a primary design concern. There's plenty of time before PHP 6, so we can get this taken care of by then, I think. These are just preliminary thoughts, but it is imperative that all PEAR classes be tested, and by inference testable, with PHP releases. Anything that comes from .php.net should work with PHP, or at least be given a chance to fix the problem before the release. This means a tighter integration of PEAR developers and PHP internals, by no means an easy task, as is shown by Pierre's tribulations over Date. At the least, it would make sense to provide some kind of PEAR-related RC cycle for PHP releases. I will see if I can shake up some ideas on how to get PEAR more involved (at least better involved) in the PHP release process over on pear-dev and report back. Greg