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Date: Tue, 25 Nov 2025 11:22:41 +0100
Message-ID: <CAB9bCb2WB5=pmfUQAtWHYCeUs6uhbe+QxeWOzU3jgqCA7y0s9w@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [VOTE] True Async RFC 1.6
To: internals@lists.php.net
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From: bart+php@croquemonsieur.be (Bart Vanhoutte)

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Op di 25 nov 2025 om 10:43 schreef Edmond Dantes <edmond.ht@gmail.com>:

> Hello
>
> > Susie doesn't know anything about the implementation, other than what is
> defined in the interface. That is literally the purpose of accepting an
> interface.
> > So it sounds like her only safe option is to restrict her usage of async
> coroutines to small self-contained pieces of code, and only use injected
> dependencies and callbacks in the "main" coroutine where they were passed
> in.
>
> Exactly. This means that for asynchronous logging, a separate
> interface must be introduced in order to guarantee correct behavior.
>

In my opinion that depends on what Susie thinks of as correct behavior, but
LoggerInterface might not be the best example to discuss shared state.
There's plenty of other examples to think of though that would not
guarantee backwards compatibility (order of lines in a file written with
file_put_contents etc).

Anyway, it seems like we're coming to the conclusion that mixing sync and
async behavior is going to cause quite some problems and is something that
would not pass a vote if I had to guess. Even if you know what you're doing
YMMV.

Am I reading the room correctly if I say that we're converging at the
sync/async toggle (ini settings, function call, whatever, ...)?

Best Regards,
Bart Vanhoutte

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<div dir=3D"ltr"><div dir=3D"ltr">Op di 25 nov 2025 om 10:43 schreef Edmond=
 Dantes &lt;<a href=3D"mailto:edmond.ht@gmail.com">edmond.ht@gmail.com</a>&=
gt;:</div><div class=3D"gmail_quote gmail_quote_container"><blockquote clas=
s=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid r=
gb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Hello<br>
<br>
&gt; Susie doesn&#39;t know anything about the implementation, other than w=
hat is defined in the interface. That is literally the purpose of accepting=
 an interface.<br>
&gt; So it sounds like her only safe option is to restrict her usage of asy=
nc coroutines to small self-contained pieces of code, and only use injected=
 dependencies and callbacks in the &quot;main&quot; coroutine where they we=
re passed in.<br>
<br>
Exactly. This means that for asynchronous logging, a separate<br>
interface must be introduced in order to guarantee correct behavior.<br></b=
lockquote><div><br></div><div>In my opinion that depends on what Susie thin=
ks of as correct behavior, but LoggerInterface might not be the best exampl=
e to discuss shared state. There&#39;s plenty of other examples to think of=
 though that would not guarantee=C2=A0backwards compatibility (order of lin=
es in a file written with file_put_contents etc).</div><div><br></div><div>=
Anyway, it seems like we&#39;re coming to the conclusion that mixing sync a=
nd async behavior is going to cause quite some problems and is something th=
at would not pass a vote if I had to guess. Even if you know what you&#39;r=
e doing YMMV.</div><div><br></div><div>Am I reading the room correctly if I=
 say that we&#39;re converging at the sync/async toggle (ini settings, func=
tion call, whatever, ...)?</div><div><br></div><div>Best Regards,</div><div=
>Bart Vanhoutte</div></div></div>

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