Newsgroups: php.internals
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Date: Sat, 22 Nov 2025 14:35:06 +0100 (CET)
To: Edmond Dantes <edmond.ht@gmail.com>
Cc: internals@lists.php.net
Message-ID: <92865666.4510.1763818506332@email.ionos.de>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [VOTE] True Async RFC 1.6
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From: mails@thomasbley.de (Thomas Bley)


> Edmond Dantes <edmond.ht@gmail.com> hat am 22.11.2025 13:37 CET geschrieb=
en:
>=20
> =20
> > basically in $result =3D foo(spawn(bar(baz(file_get_contents())))); fil=
e_get_contents() receives outside context from spawn() to turn into async m=
ode.
> > Also foo(), bar(), baz() can be in different namespaces, different clas=
ses, so by looking at the code calling file_get_contents(), it's not clear =
if the result is sync or async.
>=20
> Ok, then let=E2=80=99s look in detail at what is happening.
>=20
> > foo(spawn(bar(baz(file_get_contents()))))
>=20
> i.e.
>=20
> ```php
> $result =3D foo(spawn(bar(...), fn () =3D> baz(file_get_contents())));
> ```
>=20
> Did I understand the code correctly?
> (Assume there was also some parameter there, like a file name.)
>=20
> 1. We call `bar` in a separate coroutine, which
> 2. First calls `file_get_contents`
> 3. Then passes the result to the function `baz()`
>=20
> Is that correct?
>=20
> > Also foo(), bar(), baz() can be in different namespaces, different clas=
ses, so by looking at the code calling file_get_contents(), it's not clear =
if the result is sync or async.
> If we are discussing the code above, then it returns a Promise not of
> the file-reading result.
> This is a completely different logic, and here the programmer clearly
> intended to do something else.
> What if the function baz replaces every a character with baz? It's ok.
>=20
> ```php
> $foo =3D file_get_contents('foo.txt'); // sync
> $result =3D spawn($foo); // error because $foo is string
> ```
>=20
> Here I don=E2=80=99t understand why someone would intentionally write inc=
orrect code.
>=20
> Code:
> ```php
> $result =3D foo(file_get_contents('foo.txt'));
>=20
> // equivalent to
> // the code below has no practical purpose
>=20
> $result =3D foo(await(spawn(file_get_contents(...), 'foo.txt')));
> ```
>=20
> Is that correct?

So I guess you want to use spawn() in a similar way as call_user_func() wor=
ks.
This changes the behavior of file_get_contents() from the outside, so it gi=
ves file_get_contents() async context from the outside to behave differentl=
y.
Assuming every io operation inside spawn() runs async, I guess it's not pos=
sible to mix sync and async io inside of one function.

As mentioned before I'm not suggesting to use coroutines for async io. My r=
ecommendation would be implementing new functions for async io and a promis=
e object. Having everything that's executed async explicitly named "_async"=
 helps a lot when reading and understanding userland code.

Regarding Coroutines in Go from userland perspective: the idea is nice but =
often fails with deadlocks, hanging processes and having to run a "Data Rac=
e Detector" all the time. Sure it's always the developers fault, but it hap=
pens too often.

Best Regards
Thomas