Newsgroups: php.internals
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Xref: news.php.net php.internals:128352
Date: Thu, 31 Jul 2025 16:42:05 +0000
To: Derick Rethans <derick@php.net>
Cc: PHP Systems <systems@php.net>, PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Headers of the PHP mailing lists
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From: mathieu@rochette.cc (Mathieu Rochette)

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On Thursday, July 31st, 2025 at 18:13, Derick Rethans <derick@php.net> wro=
te:

> Hi Mathieu,
> =


> Questions around this, are probably better directed at systems@php.net,
> but it's here now, so I'll answer.

noted.

> =


> On Thu, 31 Jul 2025,
> =


> Mathieu Rochette
> =


> wrote:
> =


> > At work we built a feature in a mail client that deals with
> > newsletters subscriptions.
> > =


> > Subscriptions are identified by messages having a List-ID or
> > List-Unsubscribe header. Then, to differentiate mails being
> > newsletters or list discussions, one heuristic is to look at the
> > `Precedence` header, it can be `bulk` for mass mailing (so
> > newsletters) or `list` (discussions). And when working on that I
> > noticed that PHP lists were wrongly sent the mails with `Precedence: b=
ulk`. Is this something that could be fixed?
> =


> =


> I can certainly change the "Precedence: bulk" header to "Precedence:
> list". I would have to do that for all our 124 lists, but I am
> moderately reluctant in doing this, as Google is being annoying
> requiring specific things for email delivery, and I don't want to upset
> them again.

I would be surprised if they penalized you for this since you'll more accu=
rately describe the messages. I don't know how their delivery systems work=
s though, so I understand if you don't want to gamle on it =F0=9F=91=8C

> =


> > It's not a big deal since I've since added another heuristic that
> > works woth the PHP mailing lists (classify subscription as discussion
> > is it has a `List-Post` header) but wanted to let you know, it may be
> > useful for other clients if / when they implement features using those
> > headers.
> > =


> > Also, the List-ID is not properly formatted, it's supposed to be
> > wrapped in angle brackets but it's not, so instead of `List-Id: intern=
als.lists.php.net` it should be `List-Id: <internals.lists.php.net`> or ev=
en ``List-Id: PHP Internals list <internals.lists.php.net> to give it a hu=
man friendly name. One downside of fixing it though is that it may break a=
utomatic filtering rules of people matching exactly `List-Id: internals.li=
sts.php.net`.``
> =


> =


> We can easily change the List-Id header too, as long as I don't need to
> add a manual description to all 124 of them. So for now, I would suggest
> to change them to "List-Id: <internals.lists.php.net>". Would that work?

Yes that would be great, adding a description is optional and can be done =
later too. if you feel like it you could do it only for the most used list=
s too for example.


thank you,
Mathieu

> =


> =


> cheers,
> Derick
> =


> --
> https://derickrethans.nl | https://xdebug.org | https://dram.io
> =


> Author of Xdebug. Like it? Consider supporting me: https://xdebug.org/su=
pport
> =


> mastodon: @derickr@phpc.social @xdebug@phpc.social
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