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Date: Wed, 18 Jun 2025 13:58:36 +0200
To: =?UTF-8?Q?Benjamin_Au=C3=9Fenhofer?= <kontakt@beberlei.de>
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 <CBAF53A0-5A02-42F4-AAA7-478A22701A6A@beberlei.de>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] [Discussion] #[\DelayedTargetValidation] attribute
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From: rob@bottled.codes ("Rob Landers")

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On Wed, Jun 18, 2025, at 13:09, kontakt@beberlei.de wrote:
>=20
> Von meinem iPhone gesendet
>=20
>> Am 18.06.2025 um 11:26 schrieb Rob Landers <rob@bottled.codes>:
>> =EF=BB=BF
>> On Wed, Jun 18, 2025, at 01:26, Daniel Scherzer wrote:
>>> Hi internals,
>>>=20
>>> I'd like to start the discussion for a new RFC about adding a `#[\De=
layedTargetValidation]` attribute.
>>>=20
>>> * RFC: https://wiki.php.net/rfc/delayedtargetvalidation_attribute
>>> * Implementation: https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/18817
>>>=20
>>> --Daniel
>>=20
>> Interesting. I=E2=80=99d also argue for the inverse more than this, t=
hough. I=E2=80=99d like for my attributes to be validated during compila=
tion instead of delayed to runtime -- which, it isn=E2=80=99t actually. =
Runtime validation ONLY happens when calling ->newInstance() on Reflecti=
onAttribute, and never before then. So, only when an attribute is actual=
ly read during reflection is it validated. Further, if you never actuall=
y instantiate it ... it is never actually validated (i.e., just looking =
for the presence of an attribute, not the details).
>>=20
>> https://3v4l.org/UqQKi
>=20
>=20
> As Daniel=E2=80=99s rfc mentions you need to differentiate between com=
piler and userland attributes.=20
>=20
> The compiler attributes are validated at compile time not dueing newIn=
stance.
>=20
>>=20
>> =E2=80=94 Rob

Yes, but when would it check it during runtime? It doesn't say in the RF=
C. From what I can tell, it effectively disables the attribute, unless s=
omeone happens to enumerate and instantiate all the attributes (which is=
 unlikely).

=E2=80=94 Rob
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<!DOCTYPE html><html><head><title></title></head><body><div><br></div><d=
iv><br></div><div>On Wed, Jun 18, 2025, at 13:09,&nbsp;<a href=3D"mailto=
:kontakt@beberlei.de">kontakt@beberlei.de</a> wrote:</div><blockquote ty=
pe=3D"cite" id=3D"qt" style=3D""><div><br></div><div dir=3D"ltr">Von mei=
nem iPhone gesendet</div><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br></div><blockquote typ=
e=3D"cite"><div>Am 18.06.2025 um 11:26 schrieb Rob Landers &lt;rob@bottl=
ed.codes&gt;:</div></blockquote></div><blockquote type=3D"cite"><div dir=
=3D"ltr"><div>=EF=BB=BF</div><div>On Wed, Jun 18, 2025, at 01:26, Daniel=
 Scherzer wrote:</div><blockquote type=3D"cite" id=3D"qt-qt" style=3D"">=
<div dir=3D"ltr"><div>Hi internals,</div><div><br></div><div>I'd like to=
 start the discussion for a new RFC about adding a `#[\DelayedTargetVali=
dation]` attribute.</div><div><br></div><div>* RFC:&nbsp;<a href=3D"http=
s://wiki.php.net/rfc/delayedtargetvalidation_attribute">https://wiki.php=
.net/rfc/delayedtargetvalidation_attribute</a></div><div>* Implementatio=
n:&nbsp;<a href=3D"https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/18817">https://gi=
thub.com/php/php-src/pull/18817</a></div><div><br></div><div>--Daniel</d=
iv></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Interesting. I=E2=80=99d also =
argue for the inverse more than this, though. I=E2=80=99d like for my at=
tributes to be validated during compilation instead of delayed to runtim=
e -- which, it isn=E2=80=99t actually. Runtime validation ONLY happens w=
hen calling -&gt;newInstance() on ReflectionAttribute, and never before =
then. So, only when an attribute is actually read during reflection is i=
t validated. Further, if you never actually instantiate it ... it is nev=
er actually validated (i.e., just looking for the presence of an attribu=
te, not the details).</div><div><br></div><div><a href=3D"https://3v4l.o=
rg/UqQKi">https://3v4l.org/UqQKi</a></div></div></blockquote><div><br></=
div><div><br></div><div>As Daniel=E2=80=99s rfc mentions you need to dif=
ferentiate between compiler and userland attributes.&nbsp;</div><div><br=
></div><div><div>The compiler attributes are validated at compile time n=
ot dueing newInstance.</div><div><div><br></div><blockquote type=3D"cite=
"><div dir=3D"ltr"><div><br></div><div id=3D"qt-sig121229152">=E2=80=94 =
Rob</div></div></blockquote></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div=
>Yes, but when would it check it during runtime? It doesn't say in the R=
FC. From what I can tell, it effectively disables the attribute, unless =
someone happens to enumerate and instantiate all the attributes (which i=
s unlikely).</div><div><br></div><div id=3D"sig121229152">=E2=80=94 Rob<=
/div></body></html>
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