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Wed, 04 Jun 2025 15:04:09 +0200 Message-ID: <68d1ae56-194d-4471-8943-435ed4e09770@mabe.berlin> Date: Wed, 4 Jun 2025 15:04:08 +0200 Precedence: bulk list-help: list-post: List-Id: internals.lists.php.net x-ms-reactions: disallow MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Allow hooks in `readonly` promoted properties To: internals@lists.php.net References: <28F14D0F-8483-418D-85D1-660564A4EAE2@nicksdot.dev> Content-Language: en-US Autocrypt: addr=marc@mabe.berlin; keydata= xsBNBFby8roBCAD4qHjbk9+V3SmB5DfpkTtX58jYJ9VXVfF54MDoI0fQiYvKyrrghfO78alH c12RsEZxLH2F5kEfu8WO4wA4apg2gBnRRxqPj7krsct1ySOAdMrRVp8Wtaeaznpdcn2gJZyA MSI6LTzebT25N77ksvSrUi1BuCKyOa7SmYff3xGgOwYsHQlT5opMNGPCVegiPmO/K37anwts gj6L7RVtjXtp2Z3wAs6r3EmO318PL48xDLUgYMvEFAPJglth5FGH2En6n6HFIhxh43LqXQiN eHVjLjS2y8huNBswwc9ZVxk3ip5z/GCmpWnNkgGBOSJ7loJRsq2tOaU6yU8KWb5rhOoFABEB AAHNIU1hcmMgQmVubmV3aXR6IDxtYXJjQG1hYmUuYmVybGluPsLAeAQTAQIAIgUCVvLyugIb AwYLCQgHAwIGFQgCCQoLBBYCAwECHgECF4AACgkQOTar91O8iM6jzggAwvV6MqU/hcAI6ldp xVjucGz2J9cAWtva8GL+rm9zvEs7EENtamehJiZob/CTw50WiI/zsJzPblktpT0D2AFBEp9k P5/8CmCpZzxYPsxnLtsFM52fOBpO+aP0PSStBpJjndjBH7HPqKcTCXM3ZM+SL6lyRweAJR7G +JXIZbuUrbjB2lbGx3itNZ6TeXqqnE6KTXNKLEbNHfVdzE4sPDkmuZRo/M2h+gmeS1iQb29W BmhvL6czugCQI9rYl7C4Nci9wPii1lTYyfCWQfQKID4/F2HiOv+N/vDMCK1xV8TUeCy8w4X+ nYj+wDog046ki9lUM60oPij6WoSJLqfsXr1kNc7ATQRW8vK6AQgAq7QYLB1Dz+8RSi5AGJP1 tOFQXtcxyOhNVQZsI1mCQiHay4wteQ+5m4EOUuR+FrFIlnbSrPdTkKD2wvQDHVqpZivThBpJ vara/ick0wi2R3dasu1sPMu1P6h1EwUsydhviNJB07aLfPAWD6eoqmGTd8236znIIq7mbnNp OnxIQxviTyELUekrNw38uQtVzR6XZv9PAThA2o1J1JZID7QUpKcNyo9ebYlwxyS+xzhA4DLD qfD6O5sKoKvxEf2fIZeP0ETPpHNYk0WiWnmNoPy8eEY07LriYALVidBwPBcxus0wGoKf8Nun y2aE13SHmj0ioBI1bXMGJx3hEbvzXK6WrwARAQABwsBfBBgBAgAJBQJW8vK6AhsMAAoJEDk2 q/dTvIjOkowIAI70P8U4j3eqyK/7x1bnCZZRcpwZ1aH+LR1yMKTINo9NDqlOBWQTLT69YMfV 4UN+nTSiD/uLw1fSeLSzBwpoalCMLPVOX/d3Mq5JtL5cKtWUTIVf3Vb7VbN4Rvb8HgWjeSnM 1PiG9yQBmLKI68sG/gdgvA/xANdUatkDgG0yj8PCdt+Vy4EblXbIAXZXJ6eRugSKowTjst7i HXKOJxivomHFcmqmkiqjwGTGx/jrhbDtEpPDRk+U9W45D4CbUcyPR6lMSrje5JPGQDv/45M5 wPe286YelBjnb0cWRJpA7GZCWDKZOsQ2H6cCRBi8i4m+vfRk7GLA536XnmvWxKFVP9U= In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------a6MyPD7Wv2OXQpQaUQgMfKG7" X-bounce-key: webpack.hosteurope.de;marc@mabe.berlin;1749042250;1b127ba7; X-HE-SMSGID: 1uMnmr-00AXFe-0d From: marc@mabe.berlin (Marc Bennewitz) This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------a6MyPD7Wv2OXQpQaUQgMfKG7 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------8uYhe1UKZUJO20tyejzALe8G"; protected-headers="v1" From: Marc Bennewitz To: internals@lists.php.net Message-ID: <68d1ae56-194d-4471-8943-435ed4e09770@mabe.berlin> Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Allow hooks in `readonly` promoted properties References: <28F14D0F-8483-418D-85D1-660564A4EAE2@nicksdot.dev> In-Reply-To: --------------8uYhe1UKZUJO20tyejzALe8G Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------l5HULV9zDRVZItttmTFoswNX" --------------l5HULV9zDRVZItttmTFoswNX Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------zEhyuPstfm28pqGD0OMMr8Bn" --------------zEhyuPstfm28pqGD0OMMr8Bn Content-Type: text/plain; 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charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable

Hi Larry,

On 03.06.25 19:03, Larry Garfield wrote:
= 
On Mon, Jun 2, 2025, at 11:3=
4 PM, Nick wrote:


I would like to add, perso=
nally, I don=E2=80=99t believe the above is dumb:

```php
class Dumb {
public readonly int $value { get =3D> $this->value * random_int(1, =
100); }
}
```

I think it is a legitimate use-case.
Why wouldn=E2=80=99t a `readonly` property allow us to format, cast or ho=
wever=20
mutate a =E2=80=9Conly once written value=E2=80=9D on consumption? It wil=
l not change=20
the underlying value.
If it makes things easier for us, allow it. It=E2=80=99s not like this is=
 some=20
hidden implicit behaviour. We consciously must add the extra code,=20
hence expect the output to be changed accordingly.

It's about expectation setting.  If you see a property marked `readonly`,=
 it's reasonable to expect this to be true:

$foo->bar =3D=3D $foo->bar;

For a traditional field (pre-hooks), this would be trivially true.  With =
hooks, it may or may not be.  Saying "well, that assumption doesn't hold =
anymore, deal" is certainly an option, but it's not an option we wanted t=
o pursue as part of the larger RFC.  But that is certainly a direction we=
 could take.

I recently run into this limitation as well and I was under the impression, that a get property hook allows for replacing getter methods which isn't fully the case as seen here.

= 
So, I would love to see th=
is RFC to be implemented.
Maybe you want to move it to discussion? Then my separate thread here=20
would be obsolete.

I believe at the moment that RFC text is all there is. :-)  I don't know =
that it's worth opening a discussion without at least a mostly-done imple=
mentation.  Also, Ilija is rather busy on other tasks at the moment, as a=
m I.  (Unless someone else wants to jump in to implement it, which would =
be fine.)

I wanted to create an abstract class with a specific property defined to be readonly as it's supposed to be used as value object. Than in the implementation I wont to lazy load one of the expensive property values to.

This RFC would resolve that limitation for me :+1 but I still don't get the logic behind it.

Especially why the following is allowed from the RFC:

readonly class Laz=
yProduct {
    public Category $categ=
ory {
        get =3D> $this-=
>category ??=3D $this->dbApi->loadCategory($this->categoryId);
    }
}

but this isn't:

readonly class Ran=
dom {
    public int $value {
        get =3D> random_int(PHP_INT_MIN, PHP_INT_MAX);
    }
}

While considering someone re-writes the above Random class just to make it work with a backed property:

readonly class Ran=
dom {
    public int $value {
        get =3D> ($this->value ?? 1) * random_int(PHP_INT_MIN, PHP_=
INT_MAX);
    }
}

From the RFC text I would expect this to be allowed but it doesn't help anyone. Your described expectation isn't true anymore, the class author has more work and now it stores a needless value in memory.

Additionally, your expectation isn't true anyway as you noted in your RFC:

> On the other hand, there is no shortage of dumb things that people can do with PHP already. The exact same silliness could be implemented using __get, for instance. ...

= 
--Larry Garfield

Thanks,
Marc

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