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To: =?Windows-1252?Q?Tim_D=FCsterhus?= <tim@bastelstu.be>, Volker Dusch
	<volker@tideways-gmbh.com>
CC: php internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Clone with v2
Thread-Topic: [PHP-DEV] Re: [RFC] Clone with v2
Thread-Index: AQHbyKub/o4d+9pfyE+KjmOJcRmhMLPdI6CAgAAI4r8=
Date: Wed, 21 May 2025 15:27:22 +0000
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From: theodorejb@outlook.com (Theodore Brown)

On Wed, May 21, 2025 at 09:13 Tim D=FCsterhus wrote:=0A=
=0A=
> Am 2025-05-19 12:48, schrieb Volker Dusch:=0A=
>> We're still looking for feedback on the ...variadic approach to the=0A=
>> Syntax:=0A=
>> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/clone_with_v2#open_issues, as we only got one=
=0A=
>> reply so far on the topic.=0A=
> =0A=
> ...=0A=
>=0A=
> *Some* property name being completely incompatible with =93clone with=94 =
(no=0A=
> matter how the first parameter is going to be called) is a limitation=0A=
> that should not exist, it feels like a feature that is broken by design=
=0A=
> and I think I really would hate it if the documentation of this RFC=0A=
> would need a =93Caution: It is not possible to reassign a property called=
=0A=
> '$object', due to a parameter name conflict=94.=0A=
> =0A=
> Adjusting the signature to `clone(object $object, array $withProperties)`=
=0A=
> would not have this problem and I don't consider the additional verbosity=
=0A=
> of an array literal to be a problem. Static analysis tools already=0A=
> understand array shapes and would need adjustments either way to=0A=
> understand the semantics.=0A=
> =0A=
> From an implementation PoV a regular array parameter would also be=0A=
> simpler, since the implementation would be able to simply pass along the=
=0A=
> input array, whereas the =93variadic=94 syntax needs special handling to=
=0A=
> combine positional parameters with named parameters into a single array=
=0A=
> that is then used in the cloning process.=0A=
=0A=
The more I've thought about it, the more I also don't like the variadic=0A=
approach. It seems like a hack to try to get `property: value` syntax=0A=
for "free", but at a fundamental level the API doesn't make sense for=0A=
its purpose.=0A=
=0A=
Not only does it prevent setting a property with the name of the first=0A=
parameter (with no workaround), but it also means that someone could=0A=
call the function with positional rather than named arguments, which=0A=
as the RFC admits "for clone this is usually not useful".=0A=
=0A=
Even if it's slightly less ergonomic to quote property names in array keys,=
=0A=
I agree with Tim that it would be better to change the function signature t=
o:=0A=
=0A=
    function clone(object $object, array $withProperties): object {}=0A=
=0A=
This simply removes the issue of not being able to set a certain property=
=0A=
name, as well as the confusing positional parameter behavior.=0A=
=0A=
> Syntax-wise there might also be a middle-ground. Similarly to how this=0A=
> RFC turns `clone()` into a function, the `array()` syntax also looks=0A=
> like a function call and would naturally extend to named parameters.=0A=
> While mixing positional and named parameters would probably get complex,=
=0A=
> allowing purely named parameters would trivially be possible (without=0A=
> any function call overhead). It would also allow using the=0A=
> first-class-callable syntax with `array(...)`, something I would liked=0A=
> to have in the past. A proof of concept PR is at:=0A=
> =0A=
> https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/18613=0A=
> =0A=
> Combining named-parameter `array()` syntax with clone taking a array as=
=0A=
> the second parameter would allow for the following, which might combine=
=0A=
> the best of both worlds?=0A=
> =0A=
>     clone($obj, array(foo: 1, bar: "baz", object: "this is not blocked"))=
;=0A=
=0A=
I really like this idea! If it can work without any function call overhead,=
=0A=
it would enable more ergonomic array creation not only for `clone()` but=0A=
also in many other common scenarios.=0A=
=0A=
Regards,  =0A=
Theodore=