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Date: Sat, 21 Sep 2024 00:27:23 +0100
To: php internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Zephir, and other tangents
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From: imsop.php@rwec.co.uk ("Rowan Tommins [IMSoP]")



On 20 September 2024 20:27:34 BST, Larry Garfield <larry@garfieldtech=2Eco=
m> wrote:
>Logistical question, for those with more stdlib expertise: Since we have =
other extensions in php-src that only work if you install some other librar=
y as well (eg, curl), which distros pretty much take care of for us, would =
a small in-php-src extension that is just a thin wrapper for Wasmtime or si=
milar be viable?  Not embedding Wasmtime into the php-src code, just the ex=
tension, and it's up to the user/distro to install both so that they work=
=2E =20

This is basically what I was answering, to the best of my understanding, h=
ere <https://externals=2Eio/message/125499#125619> and here <https://extern=
als=2Eio/message/125499#125638>

It's absolutely possible to build a PHP extension that interfaces to a WAS=
M runtime, and links have been shared to at least two projects doing just t=
hat=2E Adding that to the php-src repo doesn't change what that extension c=
an do, it just marks it as "approved" in some slightly ill-defined way, and=
 restricts it to having new releases only once per year=2E

I think there's an impression that somehow by proposing that "we" add some=
 complex functionality "to the language", it will suddenly attract develope=
rs and become stable and universally adopted; but it's really the other way=
 around: once there's a mature implementation, and some people offering to =
maintain it, we can consider moving it to the php-src repo, if that seems b=
eneficial=2E (And if other constraints are met, such as licensing=2E)

At which point, some managed hosting servers might be more willing to inst=
all it=2E Not the ones who don't even install ext/curl, those are never goi=
ng to benefit from this=2E But maybe the ones who install a reasonable list=
 of features, but are a bit wary of installing PECL extensions they don't k=
now much about, can be persuaded to trust their users with a WASM sandbox=
=2E

There have been a couple of mentions on this thread of writing an RFC, but=
 I can't think of anything that an RFC could realistically propose right no=
w=2E So I say again, to those of you interested in the topic: contribute to=
 the projects already building the extensions, that's where the next steps =
are, not here=2E

Regards,
Rowan Tommins
[IMSoP]