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Date: Wed, 10 Jul 2024 20:29:16 +0100
To: PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [PHP-Dev] Versioned Packagers (Iteration IV)
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From: imsop.php@rwec.co.uk ("Rowan Tommins [IMSoP]")



On 10 July 2024 19:08:39 BST, Michael Morris <tendoaki@gmail=2Ecom> wrote:

Just to repeat a point that's been raised a few times: this is not a great=
 time of year for this kind of discussion=2E If you come back after 8=2E4 i=
s baked, you may get more enthusiasm=2E That will also give you time to mak=
e some more detailed analysis, so we don't have to argue about hypothetical=
 difficulties=2E


>1=2E Import Maps - These would be prepared by hand or by a package manage=
r
>like composer=2E

As Larry mentioned, there was a proposal for this a while ago, but not muc=
h enthusiasm, since it's so easy to implement in userland, and doing so mea=
ns we don't have to include all the possible options someone might want=2E


> it will be able to detect symbols the autoload
>system cannot: functions and constants=2E

Autoloading functions and constants isn't blocked by autoloaders being pro=
cedural, it's blocked by the unfortunate decision made many years ago that =
a function call like "strlen" dynamically falls back to meaning "\strlen", =
rather than being resolved once at compile-time like class names=2E

So far, nobody's quite cracked how that should interact with autoloading=
=2E Don't expect this to be easy=2E


>2=2E Packages - Packages load differently and can effectively monkey-type=
 the
>code of an existing package on the fly in much the same way that namespac=
es
>themselves work with symbol names as a flat string replace=2E

This is an interesting - but extremely complex - problem, and the one I've=
 been urging you to focus on if you're really up for the challenge=2E It pr=
obably needs quite a deep dive into how the language works to find out what=
 assumptions it's going to break=2E (If you're just going to talk about con=
figuration, and not the actual implementation, don't expect much enthusiasm=
=2E)


> Existing code
>can be loaded into packages, but also an outline for writing packages tha=
t
>have privacy modifiers to their members - i=2Ee=2E protected class SomeCl=
ass {}

This part seems interesting, as long as it's not tied heavily into other c=
hanges; existing code using /** @internal */ should ideally need minimal ch=
anges to make use of it=2E



>3=2E Modules - Files which are code first instead of template first=2E

If by "template first" you mean "you have to write <?php at the top", I re=
peat my earlier "meh"=2E I'm pretty sure it's also been discussed before, a=
nd dropped when it met with that general reaction=2E

The name "modules" implies something more, so maybe I should reserve judge=
ment=2E Having both "packages" and "modules" sounds pretty confusing though=
=2E


Regards,
Rowan Tommins
[IMSoP]