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Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2024 22:04:21 +0100
Message-ID: <CA+p1FaboniOZWXy4UYK1BxvO+WfwYKpndVCCcWFJHTCQUm_jkQ@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Renaming "strict types" to "scalar type coercion"
To: Robert Landers <landers.robert@gmail.com>
Cc: internals <internals@lists.php.net>
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From: davidgebler@gmail.com (David Gebler)

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On Tue, 18 Jun 2024, 17:40 Robert Landers, <landers.robert@gmail.com> wrote:

> Hello internals,
>
> Many, many people start their files fairly religiously:
>
> <?php declare(strict_types=1);
>
> and I say "religiously" because from talking to people in real life,
> reddit, workplaces, etc, very few php programmers actually know what
> this does but do it nonetheless.
>

I think there's almost certainly a degree of truth, not just in PHP but
programming in general, in the idea that there are many people who will
blindly follow a convention for no better reason they once heard someone
they considered more senior than themselves say the words "best practice"

But I don't think the meaning of strict_types in PHP is unclear. It's right
there in the manual
https://www.php.net/manual/en/language.types.declarations.php#language.types.declarations.strict

If anyone is daft enough to use a language feature without referencing what
it means or what it does, let them clean up any problems which arise for
them as a result.

If I were to support any change to how this feature works for PHP 9, I
think it would be providing a mechanism to enable it for all files at once,
maybe either via a .ini setting such as strict_types_default=1 or a new
declare which applies to all files included or autoloaded from that point
on, i.e. a declare that could be used as the first line of an entrypoint
script to make all files in a project have strict typing mode
enabled/disabled (unless a particular file overrides for its own scope with
its own declare).

Changing the name to anything other than what it is now, with or without
flipping the value, just seems like a major BC headache for no gain.

-Dave

>

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<div dir=3D"auto"><div><div class=3D"gmail_quote"><div dir=3D"ltr" class=3D=
"gmail_attr">On Tue, 18 Jun 2024, 17:40 Robert Landers, &lt;<a href=3D"mail=
to:landers.robert@gmail.com" target=3D"_blank" rel=3D"noreferrer">landers.r=
obert@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:<br></div><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" s=
tyle=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Hell=
o internals,<br>
<br>
Many, many people start their files fairly religiously:<br>
<br>
&lt;?php declare(strict_types=3D1);<br>
<br>
and I say &quot;religiously&quot; because from talking to people in real li=
fe,<br>
reddit, workplaces, etc, very few php programmers actually know what<br>
this does but do it nonetheless.=C2=A0<br></blockquote></div></div><div dir=
=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">I think there&#39;s almost certainly =
a degree of truth, not just in PHP but programming in general, in the idea =
that there are many people who will blindly follow a convention for no bett=
er reason they once heard someone they considered more senior than themselv=
es say the words &quot;best practice&quot;</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div=
><div dir=3D"auto">But I don&#39;t think the meaning of strict_types in PHP=
 is unclear. It&#39;s right there in the manual=C2=A0<a href=3D"https://www=
.php.net/manual/en/language.types.declarations.php#language.types.declarati=
ons.strict">https://www.php.net/manual/en/language.types.declarations.php#l=
anguage.types.declarations.strict</a></div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div=
 dir=3D"auto">If anyone is daft enough to use a language feature without re=
ferencing what it means or what it does, let them clean up any problems whi=
ch arise for them as a result.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D=
"auto">If I were to support any change to how this feature works for PHP 9,=
 I think it would be providing a mechanism to enable it for all files at on=
ce, maybe either via a .ini setting such as strict_types_default=3D1 or a n=
ew declare which applies to all files included or autoloaded from that poin=
t on, i.e. a declare that could be used as the first line of an entrypoint =
script to make all files in a project have strict typing mode enabled/disab=
led (unless a particular file overrides for its own scope with its own decl=
are).</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br></div><div dir=3D"auto">Changing the name =
to anything other than what it is now, with or without flipping the value, =
just seems like a major BC headache for no gain.</div><div dir=3D"auto"><br=
></div><div dir=3D"auto">-Dave</div><div dir=3D"auto"><div class=3D"gmail_q=
uote"><blockquote class=3D"gmail_quote" style=3D"margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-l=
eft:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
</blockquote></div></div></div>

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