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Date: Wed, 12 Apr 2023 19:05:56 +0100
Message-ID: <CAO__Xv7asMe0J_p8kt6LGV=Ut+Pi4vHhotjN1_U5_Dy3-1ig8Q@mail.gmail.com>
To: Reinis Rozitis <r@roze.lv>
Cc: PHP Developers Mailing List <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000558bb105f92776b6"
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Moving PHP internals to GitHub
From: fenniclog@gmail.com (tag Knife)

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On Wed, 12 Apr 2023 at 19:00, Reinis Rozitis <r@roze.lv> wrote:

>
> Sadly, there isn't anything useful being discussed just some people being
> upset about why someone doesn't (immediately) want to move to their
> [favorite] platform what gives even more validation for those who are
> against it.
>
>
> p.s. also excuses like "gmail is making me top-post and that why I can't
> write to internals" make me sad .. what have we come to / what's in the
> future ..
>
> rr
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
> To unsubscribe, visit: https://www.php.net/unsub.php


Im going to post a reply from reddit which I think encapsulates this
discussion

Posted by HappyPenguin on reddit

I say this as someone who was trying to onboard themselves the other day
(web-php and php-docs).
The entire process is archaic and uses "tools" from 20 years ago.
Onboarding for anything you're interested in doesn't really give a
direction at all (unless you're a dev).
It mostly boils down "do this, do that, after that figure it out yourself".
It really shows php's age that you have to join a mailing-list to even get
generic user support, let alone participate in development.

Php needs to get with the times, even something as simple as a forum would
be better than mailing lists for discussions.

Reading those responses from people really does not show a welcoming
environment and only puts off people from participating.
The guy may have gone about proposing the change the wrong way, but the
spirit is the same.
Modern users and devs are not going to take the time to join the mailing
list, introduce themselves, and then get possibly 60+ emails a day that
don't pertain to them.

I used to play a star trek RPG that was PBeM, then moved to Yahoo! Groups,
then moved to a software suite called SMS (Sim Management Something)
and last I checked, the group seemed to have moved to an entirely central
wordpress system.
Email lists are outdated and are no longer the right tool for the job in
99.9% of applications.

Look at the "Make WordPress" page compared to php's "Get Involved" page and
the overall onboarding experience is so much nicer and improved.
People can get a general idea of how teams works, their goals, who's
leading who,
with helpful guides and direction to get people started.


Also alot of comments about the internals terrible attitude towards the
author and to general change.

Maybe some reflection on your selfs of how the community perceives these
discussions, after all they are public.

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