Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:119889 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 5636 invoked from network); 10 Apr 2023 22:23:57 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO php-smtp4.php.net) (45.112.84.5) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 10 Apr 2023 22:23:57 -0000 Received: from php-smtp4.php.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 47328180539 for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2023 15:23:56 -0700 (PDT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on php-smtp4.php.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.8 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,DKIM_VALID_EF,NICE_REPLY_A,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW, SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_PASS,T_SCC_BODY_TEXT_LINE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-ASN: AS20857 136.144.128.0/17 X-Spam-Virus: No X-Envelope-From: Received: from outbound11.mail.transip.nl (outbound11.mail.transip.nl [136.144.136.18]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS for ; Mon, 10 Apr 2023 15:23:55 -0700 (PDT) Received: from submission6.mail.transip.nl (unknown [10.103.8.157]) by outbound11.mail.transip.nl (Postfix) with ESMTP id 4PwNmT5xnjzkQPH2 for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 00:23:53 +0200 (CEST) Received: from [IPV6:2a02:a450:3eae:1:25b4:5401:9820:5290] (2a02-a450-3eae-1-25b4-5401-9820-5290.fixed6.kpn.net [IPv6:2a02:a450:3eae:1:25b4:5401:9820:5290]) by submission6.mail.transip.nl (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 4PwNmS6QvNz12LVW for ; Tue, 11 Apr 2023 00:23:52 +0200 (CEST) Message-ID: <4c895b49-8a3c-dac0-ce9f-f9774a6f36b9@demon-angel.eu> Date: Tue, 11 Apr 2023 00:23:53 +0200 MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; Win64; x64; rv:102.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/102.9.1 Content-Language: nl To: internals@lists.php.net References: <8abbed60-5569-4eca-ad12-957877feed9b@app.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Scanned-By: ClueGetter at submission6.mail.transip.nl DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; q=dns/txt; c=relaxed/relaxed; s=transip-a; d=demon-angel.eu; t=1681165433; h=from:subject:to: references:in-reply-to:date:mime-version:content-type; bh=keEf7lQYbC9GRHKqnVNqUJqKNXzvbzkIR31+dUndkD0=; b=TiaTUnfqbYoS1sFM9xu+qirv21Ew9Z3F5zgFuAxVBS9GM1aMOKKObwg4dnsfHcuGPL4/77 JHv2Ae2dkbQiTjBsoUPdYzvKi3AVScBCuV+46EB0N7STP5hxajISXsOhkQtah3EUKvzuAH QtBUDSBbuW901tVrjWrd2/uYtOg4I2GAh41xDiX0DCMTWq8S5ULhjsJF/0KUzbxcM5Y51E 7I53zgrALdj7X7CgJ6tJiJOVtwMFZv+SQSUeIFdaEuFKX/oAEichoPn3lsDlVtq1TQEqR3 vgWr/uEHgpmFs+dfDuAkpFXX+UA6L2ETSSrIpu+VEILh07k/92VwQSnmBg3bBg== X-Report-Abuse-To: abuse@transip.nl Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Future stability of PHP? From: mark@demon-angel.eu (Mark Baker) On 11/04/2023 00:03, Larry Garfield wrote: > Here, I'll even give you a concrete example:https://wiki.php.net/rfc/saner-inc-dec-operators > > This is a good change to clean up an old buggy design. Let's suppose that we were 100% certain it would pass with 100% approval. However, if someone is doing something screwy and buggy it will change the behavior by making previously-kinda-working-but-definitely-buggy code throw a Warning, and later another oddball usage will throw a deprecation, and then eventually in PHP 9 a TypeError. Perhaps not the best example. There's definitely some cases that need cleaning up; but deprecating inc/dec for anything but numeric values is IMO too extreme in what it proposes making it little more than syntactic sugar for the += and -= operators, only working with numeric values. https://wiki.php.net/rfc/saner-array-sum-product might be a better example. -- Mark Baker