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Date: Mon, 16 Aug 2021 03:22:07 +0200
Message-ID: <CACwt+JfGMjAJYv_4DmECdX-5mpbjqwdirRBGrzpMue8psE4E2g@mail.gmail.com>
To: Tobias Nyholm <tobias.nyholm@gmail.com>
Cc: Nicolas Grekas <nicolas.grekas@gmail.com>, PHP Internals List <internals@lists.php.net>, krakjoe@php.net, 
	Ben Ramsey <ben@benramsey.com>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [VOTE] Nullable intersection types
From: patrickallaert@php.net (Patrick ALLAERT)

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Le lun. 16 ao=C3=BBt 2021 =C3=A0 02:04, Tobias Nyholm <tobias.nyholm@gmail.=
com> a
=C3=A9crit :

>
>
> On 15 Aug 2021, at 16:46, Patrick ALLAERT <patrickallaert@php.net> wrote:
>
> Le ven. 13 ao=C3=BBt 2021 =C3=A0 11:35, Nicolas Grekas <nicolas.grekas@gm=
ail.com> a
> =C3=A9crit :
>
> Hi everyone,
>
> I'm happy to announce that the vote for nullable intersection types is no=
w
> open:
> https://wiki.php.net/rfc/nullable_intersection_types
>
> It'll close in two weeks, on the 27th.
>
> Cheers,
> Nicolas
>
>
> Hi Nicolas,
>
> I am afraid that this is way too late for PHP 8.1. We are 2 weeks away fr=
om
> RC 1 and we are in feature freeze.
>
> I would recommend closing the vote and re-open it for PHP 8.2 unless I
> missed something that justifies breaking the feature freeze rule.
>
> @Joe, @Ben Ramsey <ben@benramsey.com>: your opinion?
>
> Cheers,
> Patrick
>
>
> Hey Patrick.
>
> This has been discussed already. See https://externals.io/message/115554
>
> TLDR; This is not a feature. It is to correct a mistake which is exactly
> what the stabilisation phase is for.
> Some people still think this should be for 8.2.
> The discussion started 4(!) months before the release of 8.1. It is now
> more than 3(!) months before release of 8.1.
>
> Some people claim this is being =E2=80=9Crushed=E2=80=9D. I really don=E2=
=80=99t think that adding
> this patch 3 months before a release is =E2=80=9Crushing it=E2=80=9D.
>
> // Tobias
>

Thanks Tobias.

My mail was sent a bit too fast as I do know why this is suggested for PHP
8.1 in the meantime. However I am not convinced enough by the various
arguments I've seen for not considering it as a feature change.
There's no black or white answer here as I understand it's kind of a
special case.

The current period is used for stabilization and changing something at the
syntax level is not just a simple detail. External tools (IDE, linters,
debuggers, tools manipulating stacktraces with arguments,...) may rely on
that "stability" too and may have their own schedule impacted if they want
to be ready for PHP 8.1 GA (Nov 25th).

It would be a very unanimously accepted corner case change to an already
voted RFC: it would be easy to accept it.
But here I see something that is quite debated/debatable, being voted
during holidays and potentially merged 5 days before tagging 8.1.0RC1.
Those are risky ingredients IMHO.

I know Joe would be ok with it (
https://github.com/php/php-src/pull/7259#issuecomment-883645872), but I'm
personally not confident and don't know Ben's opinion on it yet.

We (PHP 8.1 RMs) should discuss this together.

While I am not currently in favor of it, I may change my mind in the next
couple of days once I can forge a stronger opinion on it.

Cheers,
Patrick

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