Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:115486 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 94983 invoked from network); 19 Jul 2021 10:08:49 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO php-smtp4.php.net) (45.112.84.5) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 19 Jul 2021 10:08:49 -0000 Received: from php-smtp4.php.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2A7D1804F4 for ; Mon, 19 Jul 2021 03:33:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on php-smtp4.php.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL,SPF_HELO_NONE, SPF_PASS autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-Virus: No X-Envelope-From: Received: from mail-pg1-f179.google.com (mail-pg1-f179.google.com [209.85.215.179]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS for ; Mon, 19 Jul 2021 03:33:47 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-pg1-f179.google.com with SMTP id s18so18521762pgg.8 for ; Mon, 19 Jul 2021 03:33:47 -0700 (PDT) X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-transfer-encoding; bh=x/uATAxOsCPevVHrNISUZ5GMhsEJ/fIRtFMMD3fcD4c=; b=L+zYZIM7a20trR9V+TfML1r+bT4XV5EH1SGC/HsPcWJ6i22U2rn/eXH9aXdz0qmlmP rsXFzGouga8FHgC51UR9p8VrEVx5SzOKBXX5eOssGU3taRI1C/VWNNSgJ+htpDYMOE1b rCB9Nlk5sS7yWSNu9SAcaQ16xOsO3Gg73VXXsJwR8wX29m/K9wHStGTOfUHlr7s6F+g7 0ti6Rc+aXAxjj6PKFQr2oI+Ut0Yy4U96tQHBV8T/SRPiyJ/oQLGN72UqQqxIWjJJgt3k P5cfTTsYziz5Wt1Ln9Ivl7akVYaLhdvqWkX6we3VuHjJJEmURKS5jXQsDsByB+S30FBb YupA== X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM531ptJ35NyIU1hYdQUxb2MBPgZGNE5gpYiGeJAEiblQcPcuRf6Hf pCEUR/MdKyx5nd1qM1/Fdx0TxP/NuUVG/jLhN4g= X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJxH4nGC8kYQqLhqreXCva17b9hz5Dj/wD5eta2AjIE1uqKv66qkCPhgl4L2kparpfLw97bXRPDKwfnG0y1ZTR0= X-Received: by 2002:a05:6a00:178f:b029:32b:2092:c3f5 with SMTP id s15-20020a056a00178fb029032b2092c3f5mr24931524pfg.57.1626690823043; Mon, 19 Jul 2021 03:33:43 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <96487D08-8573-4308-A11C-3118113C03DA@gmail.com> <0ddf2ddc-762e-7ce6-2c3c-e2b0f55e584f@processus.org> <2a76525c-6d11-b9af-9d41-ff9fb18e4843@processus.org> In-Reply-To: Date: Mon, 19 Jul 2021 13:33:32 +0300 Message-ID: To: Lynn Cc: Pierre , Tobias Nyholm , Internals Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Request for karma to vote on RFCs From: kalle@php.net (Kalle Sommer Nielsen) Den man. 19. jul. 2021 kl. 13.14 skrev Lynn : > Currently there are people with voting permissions that do vote, yet do n= ot interact with RFCs or the mailing list. Regardless of the reasons one ma= y have for wanting to vote, the requirements given should be applied equall= y if this is the argument. If this is a problem, then why has the voting RFC not been amended to require such commentary? That seems like a productive first step in solving the issue instead of complaining about it not happening automatically > Yes, and I love it when I see new users interact with the mailing list, e= ven when in the end the questions or arguments changed nothing to the RFC. = It shows that people are probably invested. How do you measure investment b= ehind the scenes though? How often has someone decided to not post anything= on the mailing list because after testing a bunch of changes proposed, it = worked and required no comment? How can I take that into consideration if no one lets me know about that? This argument sounds more to me like an illusion, I cannot read minds nor am I into experimentation on the matter, I cannot consider what I do not know (similarly to the problem you pointed out above). > Would every user that one day would want to have voting rights post a "ye= s I agree" message in every thread in order to show they contribute in disc= ussions? That is not what I was implying and I am certain you know that. I specifically mean the discussions, not the voting itself. Taking Tobias here as an example, why is there no feedback from him on the RFCs like[1][2][3] (which was recent as in 8.1, this is just a list from a quick glance which may or not be accurate), they seem to me like an good way he could have given feedback based on the work he put forward that he had been involved with. Why is it that political power should just be given without actually taking part of the project and problems here at the PHP project? To me that comes off as laziness. "I just want to vote, but take no responsibility of maintaining the PHP project" [1] https://wiki.php.net/rfc/curl_user_agent [2] https://wiki.php.net/rfc/fsync_function [3] https://wiki.php.net/rfc/fibers --=20 regards, Kalle Sommer Nielsen kalle@php.net