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Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2021 15:10:15 -0400
In-Reply-To: <CAESVnVrFX9MWBQZPnkas+hJBgatOsuT_g1wpOcDstcD09+qASg@mail.gmail.com>
Cc: PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
To: Sara Golemon <pollita@php.net>,
 "G. P. B." <george.banyard@gmail.com>,
 Hamza Ahmad <office.hamzaahmad@gmail.com>
References: <012901d7683a$446a7ba0$cd3f72e0$@gmail.com>
 <CAESVnVrFX9MWBQZPnkas+hJBgatOsuT_g1wpOcDstcD09+qASg@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Introduce str_left/right In 8.1
From: mike@newclarity.net (Mike Schinkel)

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Replying to both Sara's and G.P.B.'s emails below:

> On Jun 23, 2021, at 12:48 PM, Sara Golemon <pollita@php.net> wrote:
>=20
> Using some context, I would assume you mean this:
>=20
> function str_left(string $str, int $len): string {
>  return substr($str, 0, $len);
> }
>=20
> function str_right(string $str, int $len): string {
>  return substr($str, -$len);
> }
>=20
> If that's the case, then.... why?  As you can see, the existing
> functionality available is trivial to write. =20
> <snip>
> Am I misunderstanding what these proposed functions should do, or am I
> underestimating the difficulty of typing a zero or negative sign on =
certain
> keyboards?

I can't speak for Hamza, but one reason I can see for why =E2=80=94 at =
least for str_right() =E2=80=94 is that using a negative index might not =
occur to many people. Hell, I even forgot substr() worked that way until =
you mentioned it.

But, since objective evidence is better than opinion, a non-trivial =
number of people have searched how to get the last 'n' characters from a =
string in PHP, found the answer, and then went to the effort to upvote =
it on StackOverflow.  If the 90-9-1 rule holds, then that's about 6200 =
people who have been confused, searched and found the answer here:

=
https://stackoverflow.com/questions/10542310/how-can-i-get-the-last-7-char=
acters-of-a-php-string =
<https://stackoverflow.com/questions/10542310/how-can-i-get-the-last-7-cha=
racters-of-a-php-string>

For future people to whom it does not occur that substr() accepts =
negative arguments, or for people who forget that fact, str_right() =
would provide an obvious solution that would be easy to find in IDE =
autocomplete or when scanning the list of functions on PHP.net. =20

At which point it would make sense to also at str_left() for symmetry. =20=


That said, my world won't change if these functions are not added, but =
adding them would be nice a little improvement to daily PHP developer =
experience.

> On Jun 23, 2021, at 10:52 AM, G. P. B. <george.banyard@gmail.com> =
wrote:
>=20
> All this to say that the burden of maintenance for such a specialized
> function makes it very unsuitable to be in core.

I have frequently heard the justification of maintenance burden =
mentioned as an objection to adding specific features.  And in many =
cases, it is easy to see why future maintenance burden would be a =
concern.

However, it *seems* in this case that these functions are so trivial to =
implement that once written and documented they would likely never need =
to be touched again. But as I do not yet know the internals of PHP I =
obviously do not know that to be a fact.

Honest question: Would you mind explaining the type of maintenance =
required for simple functions like this?  What is likely to change in =
the future that would require maintenance?  And would you mind giving a =
few or at least one example of a trivial function that did need to be =
maintained after it was written? =20

Thank you in advance for taking the time and effort to answer.

-Mike=

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