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Date: Thu, 17 Sep 2020 19:22:09 +0200
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] The case for transpiled generics
From: brendt@stitcher.io (Brent Roose)

Hi George

Thanks for the reply!

> On 17 Sep 2020, at 14:34, G. P. B. <george.banyard@gmail.com> wrote:
>=20
> Hello Brent,
>=20
> I'm going to make the argument I've already done on Reddit once [1], =
IMHO
> TypeScript is just a nicer pipeline for a preprocessor and a static
> analyser and not a language per say.
>=20
> Let me explain with a simpler example than generics, adding immutable
> objects to PHP without native language support using a preprocessor =
and
> Psalm as the back-end for static-analysis. It would be rather trivial =
to do
> a search-and-replace of the word immutable and replace it with /**
> @psalm-immutable */ at the (currently non existent) preprocessor level =
then
> run Psalm and have it shout at you if "you are doing it wrong"TM.
> Now bundle the two tools into a nice CLI command run TypePHP =
root_of_project
> and voil=C3=A0 support for immutable by just writing
>=20
> immutable class Foo {}
>=20
> And I'm fairly certain that one can achieve support for generic =
templates
> in the same way, probably harder than adding support for immutable =
objects.
> It is also possible to have various back-ends for the static analysers
> which would change the doc-annotation to the one understood by the =
analyser
> asked.
>=20
> Most importantly this can be done purely in PHP and distributed as a
> composer package.
> Therefore needing no support from the language itself, thus this can =
even
> work in PHP 7.

Preprocessing PHP has been done [1], and the reality is that it didn't =
work. Not because it's technically impossible, but because there's no =
tooling around it: no IDE integration and no static analysis. The pre =
project actually tried developing a plugin for PhpStorm, which failed =
due to plugin API limitations. Tooling and IDEs tend to follow the =
language spec, because there's no way around it. That power lies within =
the PHP project, and no one else in the community has the same amount of =
influence.

>=20
> As such I see no benefit in supporting generics at the language level =
if
> they don't have any runtime checks.

Like I said in my mail: it's not about being able to achieve a specific =
kind of functionality =E2=80=94 static analysers already support =
generics =E2=80=94 it's about giving developers an easy, integrated way =
of writing them, with as less overhead as possible. I think most new =
features added to PHP these days are a testament to that mindset =E2=80=94=
 I've already mentioned them in my previous post.

>=20
> Best regards
>=20
> George P. Banyard
>=20
> [1]
> =
https://www.reddit.com/r/PHP/comments/i9h1v8/considering_php/g1h9umy?conte=
xt=3D3

King regards
Brent

[1] https://preprocess.io/#/