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Date: Wed, 19 Aug 2020 15:50:03 -0700
Message-ID: <CAN2symjJs_TOod2U8a2q1i8yKVsAHXWg99T5err4iLA3iP28_g@mail.gmail.com>
To: Benjamin Morel <benjamin.morel@gmail.com>
Cc: PHP Internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Community vote on RFCs
From: paul.crovella@gmail.com (Paul Crovella)

On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 3:35 PM Benjamin Morel <benjamin.morel@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Paul!
>
> I'm writing off list to avoid polluting the thread too much.

I'm writing on list because it's weird that you call this pollution.

> Could you please care to explain your negative reaction to this proposal?
>
> Kind regards,
> Benjamin

You're asking for useless, no-effort feedback in the form of votes
from people who have no actual involvement in the ongoing development
or maintenance of the project, so that's what I gave you. That you
felt compelled to ask me about it highlights this significant
shortcoming of the proposal.

> On Thu, 20 Aug 2020 at 00:27, Paul Crovella <paul.crovella@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> -1
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 19, 2020 at 2:28 PM Benjamin Morel <benjamin.morel@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > Hi internals,
>> >
>> > The heated debate about attribute syntax made me think once again that it
>> > would be valuable to get feedback in the form of votes from the community,
>> > not just from core developers, on RFCs under discussion.
>> >
>> > Understandably, the RFC voting process needs to be restricted to carefully
>> > selected people, mostly core developers. But the fact is, this process is a
>> > bit elitist, and fails to represent the community as a whole. A recent
>> > thread <https://externals.io/message/111552> showed that even very active
>> > contributors to OSS are unlikely to ever get a vote.
>> >
>> > A project being nothing without its users, it would be nice to know whether
>> > an important change will make them happy or not.
>> >
>> > Therefore, I have in mind to develop (time permitting) an experimental
>> > tool, external to the PHP wiki, that would replicate the voting options of
>> > each RFC, but would allow everyone with a GitHub account to vote on the
>> > same options as the original RFC. While the vote results would not directly
>> > affect the wiki's vote results, I guess that this community feedback could
>> > be taken into consideration by wiki voters and help them make an informed
>> > decision.
>> >
>> > To be useful, a link to the community voting site would need to be present
>> > in each RFC, ideally some time before the actual voting starts on the wiki.
>> >
>> > If popular enough, this tool could offer some analysis capabilities, such
>> > as "what's the vote results from people having at least 100 commits to the
>> > top 1000 packagist projects in the last year?" to help filter out the noise.
>> >
>> > Thoughts?
>> >
>> > Kind regards,
>> > Benjamin