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In-Reply-To: <9A07334F-1A55-4E7D-88B5-7E6BABFB5E81@newclarity.net>
Date: Tue, 18 Aug 2020 12:54:44 +0200
Message-ID: <CAEPJdu=inqUNTXgbtu8V=oJ4-M+beeD5m3v=FoEwyPJ+YtwdHQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Mike Schinkel <mike@newclarity.net>
Cc: PHP Internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000a7540105ad24b77a"
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [VOTE] Shorter Attribute Syntax Change
From: kontakt@beberlei.de (Benjamin Eberlei)

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On Tue, Aug 18, 2020 at 12:36 AM Mike Schinkel <mike@newclarity.net> wrote:

> I have been following all the lengthy discussions on this topic hoping the
> list would come to consensus. And I had been hoping someone would call the
> following question but since no one else has here goes.
>
> The concept of adding attributes to PHP seemed to sail to acceptance but,
> if you count the original RFC there have been three (3) different RFCs each
> with the goal of setting or changing the decided syntax alone.
>
> For every syntax proposed there seems to be a contingent of people who are
> deeply troubled by it. Given that once a syntax lands in an official
> release of PHP there are not take backs, moving forward with any syntax
> where people are so divided seems like a really bad idea.
>
> If we care about future developers being happy enough with the decisions
> made about PHP to continue choosing PHP that I would think it would be
> incumbent upon us to find a syntax with a greater level of buy-in.
>
> Should we not:
>
> 1. Postpone inclusion of attributes until PHP 8.1 to ensure that we get a
> syntax that is reasonable acceptable to large segment of stakeholders?
>

All the technically complex decisions are done, tested and decided. The
syntax question is still open, but not critical from a technical
implementation POV. All patches regardless of syntax are extremely similar,
just replacing symbols. The non-technical implications and future related
questions are what is up for decision. The arguments for or against these
categories are by now driving in circles. Postponing to 8.1 does therefore
not bring additional value. A decision has to be made and we have enough
time for that.

>
> 2. Optionally have an RFC to ask people to vote on disputed principles,
> such as "Are ending delimiters important and thus are they required for any
> selected syntax?"
>

By voting for a syntax, these questions are answered implicitly.

>
> 3. Then open up the floor for more syntax proposals (that address all the
> accepted principles in #2) in hopes to find something generally acceptable
> to a larger segment of stakeholders with a goal of completing by 8.1?
>
> -Mike
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>

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