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Message-ID: <F0274F03-2631-44BB-93C2-E9BEE49DC5BF@benramsey.com>
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Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2020 18:15:38 -0500
In-Reply-To: <A1C95241-282A-4BF7-AEAC-93CAB56811E4@newclarity.net>
Cc: PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
To: Mike Schinkel <mike@newclarity.net>
References: <A1C95241-282A-4BF7-AEAC-93CAB56811E4@newclarity.net>
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Are PECL modules preferable?
From: ben@benramsey.com (Ben Ramsey)

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> On Mar 21, 2020, at 17:52, Mike Schinkel <mike@newclarity.net> wrote:
>=20
>> On Mar 21, 2020, at 5:59 PM, tyson andre <tysonandre775@hotmail.com> =
wrote:
>> FROM: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] is_literal()
>>=20
>> And if it can be implemented as a PECL module, that would be more =
preferable to me than a core module of php.
>> If it was in core, having to support that feature may limit =
optimizations or implementation changes that could be done in the =
future.
>=20
> Just wanted to address this comment which was made on another thread =
(I did not want to hijack that thread.)
>=20
> A large number of PHP users have no control over the platform they run =
on, so the option to use PECL modules is a non-starter for them.
>=20
> Here are several of those managed hosting platforms I speak of. =
Collectively they host a large number of WordPress sites, and Pantheon =
also host Drupal sites:
>=20
> https://pagely.com/
> https://wpvip.com/
> https://wpengine.com/
> https://kinsta.com/
> https://pantheon.io/
>=20
> Given that, if there is an option between a useful feature being added =
to core or left in PECL, I would vote 100% of the time for core, since =
working with WordPress on a corporate site I can rarely ever use PECL =
extensions.
>=20
> #fwiw
>=20
> -Mike


If at all possible, I advocate for implementing in userland. Of course, =
the specific is_literal/taint feature is special in this regard -- it =
can=E2=80=99t be implemented in userland.

IMO, PECL is an antiquated system that needs a successor, in much the =
same way Composer is the successor to PEAR. I think there are folks =
working on a solution for this, but I=E2=80=99m not sure where they are =
in their efforts. If we could make extensions as easy to package, =
distribute, and install (and load without root privileges) as Composer =
packages are, then I think we could say that PECL extensions are =
preferable.

Maybe FFI can help in this regard?

In the meantime, I agree with you that general-use language features =
that cannot be implemented in userland can serve the community best in =
the core, rather than in PECL, but their general utility will need to be =
weighed against their impact to the engine (i.e., if a feature slows =
down the engine, we can=E2=80=99t put it into core).

Cheers,
Ben


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