Newsgroups: php.internals
Path: news.php.net
Xref: news.php.net php.internals:109041
Return-Path: <aliveandshocked@gmail.com>
Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net
Received: (qmail 95630 invoked from network); 15 Mar 2020 23:19:07 -0000
Received: from unknown (HELO php-smtp4.php.net) (45.112.84.5)
  by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 15 Mar 2020 23:19:07 -0000
Received: from php-smtp4.php.net (localhost [127.0.0.1])
	by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 14D5D1804DD
	for <internals@lists.php.net>; Sun, 15 Mar 2020 14:41:23 -0700 (PDT)
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on php-smtp4.php.net
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.4 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,
	FREEMAIL_FORGED_FROMDOMAIN,FREEMAIL_FROM,HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS,
	RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H2,SPF_HELO_NONE,SPF_PASS
	autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2
X-Spam-ASN: AS15169 209.85.128.0/17
X-Spam-Virus: No
X-Envelope-From: <aliveandshocked@gmail.com>
Received: from mail-lj1-f170.google.com (mail-lj1-f170.google.com [209.85.208.170])
	(using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits)
	 key-exchange ECDHE (P-256) server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits) server-digest SHA256)
	(No client certificate requested)
	by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS
	for <internals@lists.php.net>; Sun, 15 Mar 2020 14:41:22 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-lj1-f170.google.com with SMTP id f10so16406481ljn.6
        for <internals@lists.php.net>; Sun, 15 Mar 2020 14:41:22 -0700 (PDT)
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed;
        d=1e100.net; s=20161025;
        h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date
         :message-id:subject:to:cc;
        bh=fS0hE4PRl+qdkJd7C9viIrouFLFcKiIXQCvJF88Ws0o=;
        b=MU9wAxIQ68aIXhwNXglKVR2xM4Qahl1plM4twDq14PlvDUuZCm1oQUD0UsaDgcAV49
         eSg/UNTJ0c0KGFDL1XdB74o5SVbnCqHW8687SFb99umHJ3OA/SGe2y6JZpq70j8rw/+3
         v1uNoto4rqn6dB4+2AUENM8/wEpcxUOIl+eLNQmmexVhS0Ugi+dr0zqDmFfCFoScnRBZ
         u6VlKDRJo/jn/j7tdou1s4Z43C6BLm/0hAN1LzHVnVRn6mQUi5mf+cFIIMfh4vvz4ewX
         tB46d1evJKMtEgPXgmf+f6D7LXxFeKb1IVzwRlBhaxyGqXA/DhIr9Y9dVqV8lO0tBo1n
         g1QQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: ANhLgQ35jxug0de1KfJracT++x3QPLsEROGGWS55q4R24UDKISQXgn1q
	yg52UpgGFghYSpXRFqXEu5E48SUkjZ2lhrBbHWw=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ADFU+vucVax1IwjiQ4ESZjHGHmDldOfE5up4KonydZCw3D/KCmx18EeMUUIRyfrun7xl/N1sxeqebZzwOW6ykOYrdw8=
X-Received: by 2002:a2e:b60d:: with SMTP id r13mr14247695ljn.185.1584308476577;
 Sun, 15 Mar 2020 14:41:16 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAH5C8xVYFkgyW88332ei8coMOijuynHXg3A2dL50XU4HP5Vpyw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAKuGYLTsK2h_Yeo1vMju867hhmzyHt+GwoGStcQtiYMi2VB1tg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAF+90c9RKf5PUQY0XHf=8QVVMw8jiJ=7eWfY5TTANEYt-a-ZAA@mail.gmail.com>
 <8545d15e-ddd5-42be-8405-09697a077234@www.fastmail.com> <CAH5C8xWgkUCAJguwnP69VqWXUaR+QtJRPMyBdv7B5vcnQjTD1g@mail.gmail.com>
 <4d9688fe-cc57-44af-903e-05f4cbb1bbcc@www.fastmail.com> <CALKiJKpt+xBwyEn-yVY6h_DT-c+T6nUGgye6Ocxjdcpc4fOobg@mail.gmail.com>
 <6bcbf0a5-92d8-4cfa-a00f-e0e967fc037e@www.fastmail.com> <CAOWwgpm6VJAphpdkqTo21=S6xXW=6q26v=C=H=KCF=SS0h7BoA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH5C8xVpHYW7woD-Fw_o2HvbDpsjGN0fE6Z+S3n0UxcTRBhySQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH5C8xVm5mX6tiLBnBcGTDR0XmumWxfc2q=p5a9qqtisDM-jiQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH5C8xXZKvi20ST1JLPWxuo+7Hpp933_L0WnDNqX8Dum3ukRHA@mail.gmail.com>
 <700327df-45d5-47ca-8828-d7ad9c9bee2e@www.fastmail.com> <CAH5C8xWRevvdHyNx01Eg4b_qYAESniYZdkGWfdgiPO81cL4ziQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CADyq6sKrwur9w+AvJ-hFx28=KZcDU7+2kwuGe+B_YVtKwzAo_g@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH5C8xVQ-=qzLBCaq5NcU+dbzSpFEPF5Qv0n+W+uwyEdNjhzKg@mail.gmail.com> <CADyq6sLkWoCBqY+75xBLEun8xiAFhrY9BHJ9YjhLCXuECqha=A@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CADyq6sLkWoCBqY+75xBLEun8xiAFhrY9BHJ9YjhLCXuECqha=A@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2020 16:41:05 -0500
Message-ID: <CAJmjfvUU9WvtNxW2LLhA1_Md0jFgEyY0fBPpobyZGY_ujbtfmQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Marco Pivetta <ocramius@gmail.com>
Cc: =?UTF-8?B?TcOhdMOpIEtvY3Npcw==?= <kocsismate90@gmail.com>, 
	Larry Garfield <larry@garfieldtech.com>, php internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] [DISCUSSION] Immutable/final/readonly properties
From: jakob@givoni.dk (Jakob Givoni)

On Sun, Mar 15, 2020, at 8:48 AM, Marco Pivetta wrote:
> I think what will happen is that people will start requesting for read-only
> properties with default values to be over-writable-once

Exactly, I think that intuitively, developers will not see a default
value as an actual "write".
They will expect to be able to overwrite it once.