Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:108308 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 30287 invoked from network); 29 Jan 2020 06:38:14 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO php-smtp4.php.net) (45.112.84.5) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 29 Jan 2020 06:38:14 -0000 Received: from php-smtp4.php.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id BE7481804F2 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2020 20:48:48 -0800 (PST) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on php-smtp4.php.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_LOW,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3,RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL, SPF_HELO_PASS,SPF_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-ASN: AS11403 66.111.4.0/24 X-Spam-Virus: No X-Envelope-From: Received: from out1-smtp.messagingengine.com (out1-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.25]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by php-smtp4.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2020 20:48:48 -0800 (PST) Received: from compute7.internal (compute7.nyi.internal [10.202.2.47]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 838BA21FC1 for ; Tue, 28 Jan 2020 23:48:46 -0500 (EST) Received: from imap26 ([10.202.2.76]) by compute7.internal (MEProxy); Tue, 28 Jan 2020 23:48:46 -0500 DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm1; bh=ysrBYk u7Tna8SR0+GsUOfKG1rJykV3+5+AfAmCUcrkw=; b=FbWasTLFYf881ffQEGJMTF 4lLR417UpB2W5GdlpvumJAtF9OQkEsxmRl/x/+HYlZd7jNlI4FMGuxuL4Lqfe1pL e/inAo73p1nJ2G/b/GWImy22BX3P855VudtlUWONeN/v4rowIaCO5jF0IuPRhzll kHaF1B5jOWUHS6AlpWBNUplYlWAgLEJu3q/dBZRRptKmBTSUxE2ojN7RqtJfmYj2 MiMpFYCidwamzB4cKR+XQDw7SpezMlCKTP/Yb06uU0lPRomWu0IiQ+aJrP+/0nPH rpD4W4Be2dgROJXkFUAqCL5kJrpIwatJWXKuPuFLGUNfyhXSrvnspiwnsDgmLEmg == X-ME-Sender: X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgedugedrfeehgdeiiecutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecusecvtfgvtghiphhivghnthhsucdlqddutddtmdenuc fjughrpefofgggkfgjfhffhffvufgtsehttdertderredtnecuhfhrohhmpedfnfgrrhhr hicuifgrrhhfihgvlhgufdcuoehlrghrrhihsehgrghrfhhivghlughtvggthhdrtghomh eqnecuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomheplhgr rhhrhiesghgrrhhfihgvlhguthgvtghhrdgtohhm X-ME-Proxy: Received: by mailuser.nyi.internal (Postfix, from userid 501) id 2D3C714200A2; Tue, 28 Jan 2020 23:48:46 -0500 (EST) X-Mailer: MessagingEngine.com Webmail Interface User-Agent: Cyrus-JMAP/3.1.7-781-gfc16016-fmstable-20200127v1 Mime-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <864594ef-e781-4d98-bbc1-a66330355e33@www.fastmail.com> In-Reply-To: References: Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2020 22:48:25 -0600 To: "php internals" Content-Type: text/plain Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Re: [VOTE] declare(function_and_const_lookup='global') From: larry@garfieldtech.com ("Larry Garfield") On Tue, Jan 28, 2020, at 10:03 PM, Theodore Brown wrote: > The RFC mentions two problems it hopes to solve: a minor performance > decrease, and developers having to deal with ambiguity. However, a > third problem that I think is just as important to fix is the lack of > function autoloading which makes extensive use of namespaced functions > unfeasible. Without weighing in on the RFC itself, I really don't think this statement is true anymore. Back in the day, sure; autoloading for class-like-things only made functions second class citizens. However, Composer use is now near-universal for new code. Composer can load specific files full of functions during autoload just fine, and then the functions are universally available. That would have been a performance hit, but with opcode caching the hit is minimal. With preloading in 7.4, even that is reduced to almost zero. Between those two, having a library that is mostly a pile of namespaced functions that are just always-available is quite reasonable and feasible these days. Whether it's architecturally good or bad is another question, but I don't think the lack of autoloading is a good excuse anymore. --Larry Garfield