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Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2019 00:04:48 -0400
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To: Mark Randall <marandall@php.net>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Optional pre-compiler for PHP8?
From: mike@newclarity.net (Mike Schinkel)

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> On Oct 27, 2019, at 11:20 PM, Mark Randall <marandall@php.net> wrote:
>=20
> On 27/10/2019 23:56, Mike Schinkel wrote:
>> 2. Allowing PHP to continue to meet the needs of new/less-skilled =
programmers and/or people who want a more productive language for =
smaller projects that do not need or want all the enterprisey type-safe =
features.
>=20
> This concept of type safety being an enterprise feature needs to die.

I was not trying to take any kind of position by calling it =
"enterprisey," I just needed a descriptive term and I thought that I had =
heard others on this list refer to it that way.

We could call it something else. What do you propose?

> Types are a way of preventing your program from getting into states =
that you don't expect it to be in, so you don't have to worry about =
handling them in the first place.
>=20
> Scalars, and strict types would have saved me _so much_ time when I =
started trying to learn PHP.

For the record, I too try to program as strictly as a language will =
allow.

But I am also aware that PHP has been a godsend for people who want to =
program but are newer to programming =E2=80=94 or program very =
infrequently =E2=80=94 and who struggle to get a program to just work, =
even when their programming language is super forgiving.

Many of those same people would just give up if they had to program in a =
strict fashion before they collect the experience needed to develope the =
necessary skills to program in a strict fashion. I know this because I =
was a programming trainer for many years and I have watched people =
struggle with things that were just dead obvious to me. But long ago I =
was like them too, so I have empathy for them and their deserve to be =
empowered to write useful programs even their their skill level is not =
high.

Hence the desire for a descriptive term.

 -Mike

P.S. I've also run across lazy programmers who program full time but =
have no desire to get better. And I have fired many of them too. I have =
no empathy for them.=

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