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Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2019 09:35:47 -0400
Message-ID: <CAPKYkKxW1SaomO4LVzfeCroj6eQkw3habRgATNRNesiEizwm5A@mail.gmail.com>
To: Vesselin Kenashkov <kenashkov@gmail.com>
Cc: Pierre Joye <pierre.php@gmail.com>, Benjamin Eberlei <kontakt@beberlei.de>, 
	Zeev Suraski <zeev@php.net>, PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000873b010592abb005"
Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Defining the PHP Group
From: chasepeeler@gmail.com (Chase Peeler)

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On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 7:01 AM Vesselin Kenashkov <kenashkov@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On Mon, Sep 16, 2019 at 1:23 PM Pierre Joye <pierre.php@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > The only thing I dislike a lot is the general tone of these
> > discussions, that should be different, that makes me sad and really
> > not willing to participate in any way.
> >
> > Hi everyone,
> I just want to second that feeling of Pierre. Im a userland developer and
> just wanted to express that as a person outside internals following the
> recent discussions, Im really sad for the reason of the tone used, the
> amount of human/brain energy used/wasted in these and as someone mentioned
> already it may happen certain developers to abandon the project due to all
> that. And this is the last thing I would say we all want (both internals
> and externals).
>
> In regards to the 2/3 majority - I would say that in case the minority
> opposition is very strong (like in the votes on short tags and warning
> levels) isnt it possible to reach a compromise? Like acknowledging the vote
> but postpone the implementation for another major version? I understand the
> majority rule and the rules of the democracy but again according these
> rules even when certain decision passes through and there is still very
> strong opposition compromises are sought after.
>
> In regards to error levels RFC, many of us that strongly felt we shouldn't
do what was proposed at all, were at least willing to accept a compromise
where the changes became opt-in via ini settings or a declare. Both of
these suggestions were strongly rejected by those in favor of the RFC.


> With the above Im not trying to push my point over the specific RFCs - I
> fully understand the implications there and have an option on these but
> this is offtopic. At this point considering how much stress these have
> caused I would say I got to the point that Im fine with either of the
> votes/implementations as long as the PHP team doesnt suffer any harm in
> terms of loss of people or massive waste of brain effort.
>
> And I understand that this topic is about the governance of the project
> etc... just wanted to bring the attention of the group to the fact that
> even on 2/3 in certain cases compromises may be needed and this to be taken
> into account when deciding on the governance/voting process.
>
> Thank you all
>
> Vesko Kenashkov
>


-- 
Chase Peeler
chasepeeler@gmail.com

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