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In-Reply-To: <b06bb988-fa0c-50c0-3704-3091d78d42a9@korulczyk.pl>
Date: Fri, 13 Sep 2019 09:59:33 +0100
Message-ID: <CAAwbVuckFaURm2yTeSrhwKEHkUh+YRPsM7oM5-3wyBXvq-xdNQ@mail.gmail.com>
To: Robert Korulczyk <robert@korulczyk.pl>
Cc: Mike Schinkel <mike@newclarity.net>, Chase Peeler <chasepeeler@gmail.com>, 
	PHP Internals List <internals@lists.php.net>
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors
From: oludonsexy@gmail.com (Olumide Samson)

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I'm thinking this thread is receiving much attention than really required.

Irrespective of the left and right argument, I think everyone wants a
better language, the leftist are just arguing on a very lazy fact, not that
they don't see anything bad in their wrong argument they are all just
trying to hide behind "We know it is bad or can be devastating, let's just
leave it as it is and hope nobody ever have reasons to clean it since it is
still working" but me and those rightist are all like, this is wrong let's
save billions of codes that could still be added to this buggy behavior
than leaving it and hoping it would be one of the best dynamism people want
from PHP.

How does bug translate to dynamism?

Why were there notices if something wasn't wrong somewhere with the
behavior?

If I'm to argue as php-src(being human), I would never allow those leftist
to use me to write code again coz it is highly straining to pretend to know
what an undefined variable meant( to be an int or string, or even an
object) or even if it was a typo.

We are straining the language performance even more by making it guess what
the undefined variable would have been.

Even a string would still go up as integer the moment you add ++($i++) to
it.

Why don't you people see it is safe and would be in everyone's best
interests if we could clean this garbage behavior once and for all to live
peacefully, and possibly reduce the amount of baggage behavior lying around
in millions of codes out there, coz the counts increase every single day
because everyone thinks it is the right behavior yet their error_log keep
on getting notices?


Zeev said the RFC was never meant to deprecate things and as such the
voting would eventually not pass on to implementation even if it was
accepted -

"why then do you vote no on the RFC if it was never a valid vote to count?"

I think voting on the RFC validates the RFC for all you've voted it for
which means it's a valid way to deprecate features, else all formerly
deprecated features can be reverted since they are invalidated by the
current situation(or eye opening statement you just made).

I think we all need to see from the right spot how many people and code we
would save if this garbage were reported as Warning or error as early as
possible than waiting for never yet still giving me notice in my error_log
everytime PHP hit an undefined variable.

One thing some people are forgetting is that this is an open source
community and people(myself included) coming here to pull, push, commit,
test, manage and even join the mailing list are not getting paid by anyone
to do so(there might be an exception), and being an open source project we
all need to agree to disagree no one has any authority over anyone.

If there's been some laid out rules about some chairmen and the authorities
they posses to always swing things in their favor, I'm very sure this
project would have been dead on arrival( while there are so many projects
wanting attention), since a open source project needs help from
contributors I think we all need to think properly about rules or
guidelines that might hurt the project's contribution.

I don't pray to see PHP 9 timelines not posted by anyone(coz there's no one
around to do so) or even php-src to be one of those languages where their
contribution reduced drastically based on some people's bad influence
affecting the other contributors.

Let's argue rightly and expect other people to not agree with us, that's
the default.

Thanks,
Samson(noobshow)

On Fri, Sep 13, 2019, 9:11 AM Robert Korulczyk <robert@korulczyk.pl> wrote:

> > Upgrading the ~68,000 open source plugins available on wordpress.org <
> http://wordpress.org/>, thousands of commercial plugins, and and an
> untold number of custom-developed bespoke plugins and custom themes is
> where the concern lies.
>
> Many of these are ticking bombs - unmaintained extensions with possible
> security issues. Right now the biggest problem of WordPress ecosystem is
> quality of community extensions and themes. Cutting of all old and
> unmaintained extensions may be not that bad...
>
>
> Regards,
> Robert Korulczyk
>
> --
> PHP Internals - PHP Runtime Development Mailing List
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>

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