Newsgroups: php.internals Path: news.php.net Xref: news.php.net php.internals:106991 Return-Path: Delivered-To: mailing list internals@lists.php.net Received: (qmail 5138 invoked from network); 12 Sep 2019 20:18:44 -0000 Received: from unknown (HELO php-smtp3.php.net) (208.43.231.12) by pb1.pair.com with SMTP; 12 Sep 2019 20:18:44 -0000 Received: from php-smtp3.php.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by php-smtp3.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3635D2C0464 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 10:54:41 -0700 (PDT) X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.2 (2018-09-13) on php-smtp3.php.net X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.0 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,DKIM_SIGNED, DKIM_VALID,DKIM_VALID_AU,FREEMAIL_FROM,HTML_MESSAGE,RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE, SPF_HELO_NONE autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.2 X-Spam-ASN: AS3215 2.6.0.0/16 X-Spam-Virus: No Received: from mail-vs1-xe32.google.com (mail-vs1-xe32.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::e32]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by php-smtp3.php.net (Postfix) with ESMTPS for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 10:54:40 -0700 (PDT) Received: by mail-vs1-xe32.google.com with SMTP id g11so16447862vsr.8 for ; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 10:54:40 -0700 (PDT) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=oiBBkhqpMU1UTTjoe1xIY1GTBawGAVy33EqdCtimh2Q=; b=gxkjhe06JYR7SaDjXt5RyphbtfcRUcMbQGRN1ayDQk6gjbdB+7oyfUIB1HvxfeysG1 D1TgLPte51skpwa3+WNwQFFXtzDOb7YYu8qMczOr9C+4MDfF9NV+o4o1QGv7R8i4Bg/b +Ra1F1aX7BEXeKa8RtDDcEAf97vjwVMWW4OX+MpoDG94tJK8rMjdMsPctPvHM/IPofYN P71VlcTh5TN4Bq9BSBfeKF4y+Dsx9NIP4cBOyMfJdA1F1fohEzBJ9rTXU469XulWvCl8 s4dPIUnOdwCHr7XI1CgGOk3OeHH04Ker60IlwQs8CveOOi9J0IfJjN2y2DAI94HQTmts CD4g== X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=oiBBkhqpMU1UTTjoe1xIY1GTBawGAVy33EqdCtimh2Q=; b=QPRnG+uawKnbagTG3Gh0+twObed4oQk3Jjh47ymXKwUAf39mo3dedj5zgudqEEqINg avhl7i9hPvMlMcJw7aVOx184hXm5HmHHo+jNZoOpU8OPSc9Lrhy69KbZlm5o+BcYNsF7 4+zh9cGXV7xJ9svWqW0c0uMeP/3l0Q+H4dH0+o1uGfsyJXMyFxs8Wme8yTMS/luDRdrV QCAoAh7/r9x4GJYvBuuLd7rHVphRkx6o25ALQ29FTldE/fqv0Z3oLoO6fTOwnlqfIRak ephkLSQA5DxiJmcc26EgiLiGDYKJilBQDmrJThw5ERMdE8KKfVeOTT0etOYRSFqMj8vG wMig== X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAUKJxE8Yd7Nf0QQsyEq7dkhscH+6bKB2hntS1wCRpbfxBIYfmTn 9t0nw+Y143dR+pDpUrh3HM6U4+IZeV8UQfm3DqI= X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyiAbYXo+dUC2bc+W+FtFNDC2nrxHwugEk8N/q6UOfVrQ4/v0FhQJBC66sd7wEv0BALN7kr+hTk631eGsCYHww= X-Received: by 2002:a67:f895:: with SMTP id h21mr22010384vso.74.1568310879613; Thu, 12 Sep 2019 10:54:39 -0700 (PDT) MIME-Version: 1.0 References: <076701d56978$86020910$92061b30$@php.net> <078e01d5697c$5512bc10$ff383430$@php.net> In-Reply-To: Date: Thu, 12 Sep 2019 13:54:28 -0400 Message-ID: To: Matthew Brown Cc: Scott Arciszewski , Zeev Suraski , Marco Pivetta , PHP Internals List Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000e07aef05925ed494" X-Envelope-From: Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] Changing fundamental language behaviors From: chasepeeler@gmail.com (Chase Peeler) --000000000000e07aef05925ed494 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" On Thu, Sep 12, 2019 at 1:33 PM Matthew Brown wrote: > What if Java suddenly said that all properties are suddenly private, and >> can only be accessed through getter/setter methods? >> > > If Java announced that the next major version was to make the change after > 95% of userland developers favoured it and over 2/3rds of their internals > team did, I'd think "huh ok I guess they have good reasons". > > I call shenanigans on that 95% number. Can you please back that up? Personally, I don't think it's even possible to gauge userland support because the vast majority of userland developers aren't involved in the community at all. Those people don't even know this is being discussed, and probably won't until they start looking to upgrade to PHP 8. > For 20 years people have developed code based on that feature. It was >> never considered an error, and often not even considered bad practice > > > You seem to be arguing against *ever* changing something that a majority > once thought was good, and fundamental to a given system. Lots of things > fall into that category - restricting voting to men, segregation, etc. > >> -- Chase Peeler chasepeeler@gmail.com --000000000000e07aef05925ed494--