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To: Matthew Brown <matthewmatthew@gmail.com>
Cc: Zeev Suraski <zeev@php.net>, PHP internals <internals@lists.php.net>
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Message-ID: <b024d0fe-ac0f-d9b9-a389-b25804ac40db@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 28 Aug 2019 15:06:19 -0700
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Subject: Re: [PHP-DEV] [RFC] Reclassifying engine warnings
From: smalyshev@gmail.com (Stanislav Malyshev)

Hi!

> If we want PHP to be as easy as possible then $nullref->bar(),
> $foo->someUndefined(), new UndefinedClass etc shouldn’t be exceptions
> either - they can just be notices.

I don't see how it follows. Calling unknown method does not have natural
default - if I tell you "would you please do abracadabra" you can't just
do something random and consider it done - you should tell me "what do
you mean by that? Please explain what you want me to do".
However, if I tell you "here's an apple, add it to your pocket", then
there's a natural way of knowing how many apples is in your pocket for
every state of your pocket before - if your pocket was empty, it now has
one apple, if it had apples before, now it has one more. I don't need to
explain you what to do when your pocket is empty and when it's not
separately - you can guess intuitively what should happen in each case
and you'd be 100% right always.

That's the natural difference between $foo++ and foo() - in the former
case, you know what should happen in any case (including when $foo is
initialized to a non-numeric value - *then* you error out), in the
latter, if foo() is not defined, there's no natural way to go but to
error out. There's a crucial difference here because variables are
containers, not actors. Dealing with an empty container has natural
semantics (in some cases at least), dealing with non-existing actor does
not.
-- 
Stas Malyshev
smalyshev@gmail.com